Canada To Let Quebec Go?

by metatron 82 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  mamochan13

  I think Quebec is a beautiful province and Canada is richer for it. One of my son-in-laws is from Quebec, and I've had the opportunity to visit Montreal. My province has a fairly large french community as well. I'm not crazy about forced bilingualism, but a second language is a good thing.

  HOWEVER....Talesin is completely right. The rest of Canada has been held hostage by Quebec's threats. Every time they threaten, they get all kinds of political concessions and extra money - so it's become an efficient tactic.

  A disproportionate amount of tax dollars go to Quebec, and the federal government's favoritism towards that province is quite staggering. Federal transfer payments, for example. Alberta gets half of what Quebec gets, yet Quebec's GDP is higher than Alberta's. That's just one example. Government bailouts for companies like Bombardier have disproportionately enriched Quebec. Up until last year, Quebec received more half of the federal budget for Canada Day festivities - the rest of the provinces divvied up the rest. Quite the irony, really.

  One thing that has always angered me is the huge difference in university cost. Quebec students are striking against small increases. In Quebec, the average cost for university is $2500 a year, while Canada average is $5,300. The majority of the other provinces are well over $5,000 a year. Only Manitoba and Newfoundland are lower. Alberta students pay $5,600. Why? Perhaps if we received a fairer share of federal money, we could lower our tuition, too.

  So, no. Quebec could not survive without the money it receives from the rest of the provinces.
• 

  Satanus

  In montreal, which is basically an international city, french is the official language. So, if tourists or english speaking residents get english service from any establishments, it's purely out of politeness, or forbearance, or because of those rendering services are themselves english. Yet, all federal govt agencies are required to provide french services, anywhere in the rest of the english nation. All federal employees must be able to carry on in french. However, in quebec, french is the only requirement. Is this hypocritical?

  S
• 

  sammielee24

  Goodness me. Never read an article on Quebec separating from Canada and believe it and never listen to a Canadian politican who represents the Separatist Movement, tell you that Quebec is it's own country already.

  This is a subject dear to me. I am French and English. My family were some of the first from France to settle in 'Quebec' in about 1657 and they struggled as people did in those days, to create a new society in a wild and foreign land. They brought with them their religion, their traditions, their language and various dialects and their service to the French Crown of the day. I understand the prejudice, challenges but also, opportunity, that the new world provided them. We have been here for 12 generations now and I am proud to be of French heritage.

  I am also very much Irish/Welsh and English who suffered through the Irish and Celtic genocide - and proud of that heritage.

  Having said that - I do not believe Quebec will ever separate. They have no economic basis to survive on and this is indeed noise that continues on forever. There are things that I don't like about Quebec now but those aren't against the people - more often it is against separatists who seem to want to force people to choose a side or forgo their own heritage.

  I do have issues with funding sources and some other issues as they relate to specific 'right's' that some people believe they are entitled to - but those are my own and they don't make me racist nor does it mean that I am ignorant of the history or facts of any situation.

  Looking hurriedly, this is the shortest summary that I could find on when the laws were enacted - sammieswife.

  -------

  Another challenge is that posed by the French laws applied from the inception of New France to even today. In the 1763 Treaty of Paris, Britain agreed to allow the French to keep their language, civil laws and customs. In 1791 the civil code was repealed to bring in English common law for the United Empire Loyalists located in what is now Ontario. However, Lower Canada (Quebec) was allowed to keep French civil law. Thus even after Canada became a British jurisdiction, the French in Lower Canada still observed the "Custom of Paris" or Code Louis. As the systems evolved in Lower Canada, they remained separate and unique. For example, even though the Code Napol6on was enacted in France nearly a century after New France had become a British colony, this was adopted as the basic civil code for Quebec when they reformed their laws in 1866 and remained in effect until the new Quebec Civil Code, which came into effect in 1994. The challenges created due to the different structure of law in Quebec are several, especially to those used to the English systems.
• 

  Satanus

  Hey Sammies

  I never knew that you were in quebec. Like i said, i see both sides.

  Typically, the british use a divide and conquer method, see the middle east and india as examples. Giving concessions makes them look magnanymous, while setting up entities w inherent weeknesses that leaves britain in the power position. The usa, which managed to break away to an extent from britain, stressed the leaving of previous cultures and adopting the new american one.

  S
• 

  tec

  Not going to happen. I mean, there are plenty of people who say go ahead and do it then...but what benefit is going to come to Quebec if they do this? Still going to be dependent on Canada and the resources of the rest of the country, or the States if they want to go that route. Be harder for them after they were separate, and they have to know this. So I can't see them ever wanting to do more than threaten to leave.

  Of course, not even the majority of the people in Quebec want to separate.

  Peace,

  tammy
• 

  tiki

  and texas wants to secede from the union.

  as a northeastern american - i see quebec is significantly different from the rest of the provinces of canada....but you guys can wrangle this one out!
• 

  sammielee24

  I don't live in Quebec Satanus. I was born and raised in Ontario but have lived all over North America. My family is a mix of French and English (used to denote UK) and so they have kept a great many traditions from both sides. I have both Catholic French relatives and Protestant English relatives. I have French and English speaking. My English GGrandfather fought and was rendered disabled in WW1 but I have French relatives who didn't feel the need to fight a war 'not theirs'. I eat tortierre on one side but salmon pie on the other. I have many family members who claim Metis - I have done my due diligence in learning about all sides of my history and still live with many of those traditions. Like I said - I do object to some 'right's' in the way people feel a sense of entitlement that has less to do with wanting to really understand their heritage and live it, than it does with money and/or some sense of power or difference.

  I feel sometimes when I hear people complain on every side, they don't recognize the paths people almost 400 years ago forged for them - they don't recognize that today we might not do things the same way, but they ususually did what they could. I am not Catholic but I understand the hold the church kept on generations in my family because they were essentially the law in this land for a hundred years.

  As for the USA - on my fathers side - his family line goes directly back to the Puritans and their arrival in Connecticut until they broke off and moved northward. I would argue that in reality, much of the USA was primed and processed on British thought and everywhere you look there remain links to that country. They may have shrugged off the Pope for two hundred years, but in reality, the established hierarchy could perhaps be said to be based on the British sense of entitlement and power to money. Just opinions of course..

  sammieswife
• 

  tec

  and texas wants to secede from the union.

  as a northeastern american - i see quebec is significantly different from the rest of the provinces of canada....but you guys can wrangle this one out!

  I guess there's one in every family :P

  I feel sometimes when I hear people complain on every side, they don't recognize the paths people almost 400 years ago forged for them...

  All joking aside, this is too often at the root of many 'rivalries'... people forgetting the history that leads to the present.

  Peace,

  tammy
• 

  aposta-Z

  Satanus: " in quebec, french is the only requirement. Is this hypocritical?"

  Living in Montréal, I can say that unless you speak both French & English... you'll find work but will not make alot of money. Most decent jobs require that you understand and speak English.
  Learning a second language isn't that hard. It is impossible to do business in this global economy unless you understand English. Québecois know this. They also know this in India.

  This is my analogy.

  If I were to tell you that I am a baptized Jehovah's witness, that I no longer believe in the cult propaganda; but I stay in because my employer is a "brother". I think critically and want to make my own decisions, but I'm too afraid to lose my job. I hope you would tell me: "screw your job, even if you end up being poorer, you independance from the org is more important".
  
  To those whose say Québec will never separate because of money, think again. It has nothing to do with it.
  
• 

  Satanus

  ' To those whose say Québec will never separate because of money, think again. It has nothing to do with it. '

  I understand this. The values in quebec are simply different. Their values are basically cultural. For the rest of canada, values are more materialist oriented, or power oriented, except for perhaps some of the eastern maritime areas. However, their values don't stop the quebec politicos from playing the federals and the other canadians.

  S