At what point do the individuals in the ORG need to take responsibility for their actions?

by vajeni82 16 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  vajeni82

  So, I'm sitting here, being pissed about my family. Both of my parents and my only sister are JWs. I haven't had a relationship with them since they I left in 2002.(Abusive husband, no legal grounds for leaving etc etc. You can read the whole story in my intro post.)

  I'm wondering: Am I wrong to be personally pissed at them for the choices they have made? It's so easy to blame the JW ORG for making them shun me. But really, WTF? Everyone has free will. They have CHOSEN to stay and follow this BS. They choose to shun me. They decided to follow this path.I don't buy the whole "they made me do it" philosophy. In fact, if the ORG decided to change their shunning policy & they tried to contact me, I think I'd tell them to stick it up their asses. As long as they are part of this cruel organization, I don't want them around. They have wronged me in so many ways.

  Tell me the truth... Am I just a jerk? Is anybody else pissed like me?
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  Hortensia

  I agree with you. Even though they personally abdicate responsibility, and do whatever the wtbts tells them to do, in the end they are responsible for their choices -- such as the choice to follow the wtbts in the first place. The consequence in this case is that YOU no longer want anything to do with THEM, because of the harm they have done by making that choice.
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  flipper

  VAJENI 82- I really feel for you my friend. I've been shunned as well by my two adult JW daughters 26 & 24 yrs.old since 2003 when I stopped attending. In answer to your questions : No, you're NOT a jerk. And yes I AM pissed off like you are. And rightly and justly so. for being treated inhumanely and unethically by family or former friends we had in JW land.

  It's a normal human reaction to be pissed and angry and saddened. If we weren't upset about this treatment we'd be unemotional programmed robots like Jehovah's Witnesses. And partly ( emphasis on partly therein lies the problem ). It's true as you say that yes, ouur JW relatives pick to shun us - however they are MENTALLY ill. I'll repeat that- they are MENTALLY ill . It's a psychiatric disorder that comes from being under the influence of mind control, brainwashing , or whatever else you want to call it, and yes the WT organization mind control tactics ARE that powerful and influential. What they have is called " dissociative disorder " an actual clinically diagnosed mental condition that allows them to dissociate from their true human born-in authentic empathetic personality and it gets replaced by the cult personality. This happens in Scientology, Jw's, any high control organization where members are coerced to go along with leaders behavior and views to be accepted.

  I'm not saying it's O.K. to use that as a copout for them not being responsible for their barbaric, inhumane behavior- but it is definitely a factor that causes them to be blinded to their own sick behavior. That being said your point is well taken that until THEY change it's very difficult for US as ex-Witnesses or never have been Witnesses to be around them. I have some family who are JWs and it's like walking on eggshells around some of them who I do see every once in awhile. But then you have psycho, fanatic Witnesses like my daughters who just are totally unreasonable and captured in their minds by WT policy.

  We have the right to decide who we want in our lives and who we don't want, so you certainly are yes within your rights to determine that. I don't blame you at all for being mad. I'm mad too, but I do hope that someday many of these JW relatives will change, especially my daughters . And because of what I understand about mind control and its influence, I'll be there to welcome them back with open arms f they ever change their views. Sometimes the hurt may have been so bad that you wouldn't be able to forgive and forget- and I understand that as well.

  Please know that we are here for you friend if you ever want to talk. I'm so sorry you've been shunned and hurt by your family . We have your back. O.K. ? Hang in there, take care
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  Gopher

  Am I wrong to be personally pissed at them for the choices they have made?

  It's only human to be upset. Apparently you have no contact with them, so they probably aren't aware of how it continues to upset you. It seems this still eats at you.

  I have a hole in my heart too because I was DF'd (wrongly in my opinion) in 2000, but my parents fully support the JW elders against me. I was really upset by their decision. They are 75 and 80 years old and live 1,000 miles from me. They'll never change, so I've let them become like distant relatives to me. Their decision doesn't affect me any more, even though I feel a small twinge of emptiness if I let myself dwell on the past.

  They choose to shun me. They decided to follow this path.I don't buy the whole "they made me do it" philosophy.

  You know your family better than anyone reading this. With my parents it's tough to know where to draw the line -- how much do I blame the WT Society for planting fear and loathing into my parents, and how much do I blame my parents for accepting it? I have decided in their case it's 50-50. I know how wary I was of DF'd people when I was in the organization .... and yet, I have correspondence with my sister proving I kept in regular friendly contact with my sister who disassociated herself in 1984. We weren't best friends or anything, but it wasn't hostile. (My sister and I are really close these days.)

  In fact, if the ORG decided to change their shunning policy & they tried to contact me, I think I'd tell them to stick it up their asses.

  I'm with you here. I don't trust the organization at all. They've gone through short times of liberalization, only to clamp down again. I wouldn't want to risk having the rug pulled out from under me. However if my parents miraculously decided to leave the JW's, I'd be here to welcome them with open arms.

  Am I just a jerk? Is anybody else pissed like me?

  No to the "jerk" question, and I wouldn't described myself as "pissed" any more, just disappointed and a little empty. It was very upsetting to me for a while after 2000, but I can't honestly same I'm pissed any more - each situation is different. I have just moved past them now. I have so much to live for, and they have their organization to live for. If that's what makes them happy, c'est la vie.
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  Chaserious

  I don't blame you. I feel the same way about my family. I know of other parents who play a little loose with the DF rules and my family doesn't. So, not only do they choose to follow the policy but they follow it strictly, and that's on them.

  I feel pity for them in a sense, in that they let such an organization cause them to sever normal human family ties and lose out on a relationship with their son for no other reason than not agreeing on religious doctrine, but I hold them just as responsible too. Some things are just natural -like loving your family - and you shouldn't need anyone else to tell you that it's okay or not okay.
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  Tiktaalik

  I think each individual witness is totally responsible for their actions. The "I was only following orders" excuse holds no moral, ethical (or legal?) value in any circumstance.

  I hold my family totally responsible. They have chosen to completely shun me, to treat me as if do not exist, and I'm not even disfellowshipped. I have not had any contact with my sisters for 15 years. I tried so many times to reach out to them but I was rebuffed at every turn. A few years ago I just ruled a line under it and moved on.

  I blame them for their intectual timidity and their lack of personal integrity. How they could treat a close family member like that is reprehensible. They may have been instructed to do this by the wts but they chose to personally enforce it.

  I personally do not give a shit about them now. They are flawed human beings and deserve derision.
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  vajeni82

  Thanks for making me feel like less of a jerk. You'd think after 11 years, I'd be over it. I will say, I have accepted it, but until recently, I've chosen to ignore it. It's only recently I've started to process my feelings. I never even made contact with another ex-JW until about a year ago. Now that I'm done keeping secrets, I have a lot to deal with. Now that I'm a mom, I find this whole situation even more repulsive.

  Mr. Flipper - I'm sorry to hear about your daughters' behavior. My daughter is only 17 months, and honestly I have to agree that there is no amount of wrong she could do to me that I would never be able to forgive. As a parent, it's my duty to love her unconditionally. I think that's part of the reason why I am so upset with my own parents. There are people on death row who have parents that love them. All I did was stick up for myself. I guess I have a double standard on the issue. In my mind, I assume they'd never leave the JWs. They'd only try to be in contact with me if it were allowed by the GB. In that sense, I think I'd rather just not deal with it. "New Light" is not going to sweep their actions under the rug for me. If my sister ever reached out to me, I'd be more responsive. If she were still in the JWs, it would be very difficult for me though.

  Hortensia, Gopher & Chaserious - Thanks for sharing your experiences. Just knowing I'm not alone makes a big difference. It's so sad to see how this BS has impacted so many families. It needs to stop.
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  rebel8

  Every adult of sound mind and body is responsible for his/her own actions...including those who lied, manipulated, pressured and brainwashed others.

  Children and persons not of sound mind and body are not responsible for their choices.

  An argument could be made that born-ins are less responsible because they were not given the reasoning skills, education and exposure to "normal" to be able to make an informed choice. I mean, I got out ASAP, but I don't think everyone is quite as rebellious, courageous or independent as I am.
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  jamiebowers

  You and I left the Watch Tower cult under similar circumstances, and I've been shunned by my jw family for 25 years. I overcame the resentment by seeing these people for what they really are; unhealthy association. In reality, both of our families would've rather seen us endangered or dead at the hands of our jw husbands rather than have a free, safe life. It isn't any different than letting us die due to a lack of a blood transfusion.

  Personally, I don't care whether their shunning comes from their own evil, cult influence, or a combination of both. The fact remains that they don't have our realistic best interests at heart. If it was anyone else, would you want to associate with delusional people who would rather see you die than disagree with them?
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  Mum

  We are all responsible for our own behavior. People often do things contrary to their nature out of fear. The JW's are steeped in fear. They think it's fear of a bloodthirsty god, but it is actually fear of the elders and their fellow witnesses. They are in a high control group with an all-or-nothing mentality. It is very frustrating to deal with people like that, and frustration naturally leads to anger.

  I hope you are building a happy and fulfilling life for yourself. You need to build your own support group independent of your family. Take care of yourself, and don't let them make you bitter.

  Regards,

  SandraC