warped logic from the memorial talk

by why144000 54 Replies latest jw friends

  • I quit!
    I quit!

    First thing that came to mind when I read your post was exactly what Terry said. Jesus said do this till I return...well didn't he return in 1914? I mean in their mind not in reality.

    A big part of the problem cults have when they make things up claiming some special knowledge is that they don't think things completely through and then find themselves in trouble trying to explain their position which usually leads to more lying and making more things up.

    They didn't think it through when the came up with their two class of Christian system. The partakers (heavenly hopers) non partakers (earthly hopers). They didn't look far enough into the future to see a time when their KH would be filled with people passing around the wine and crackers and no one partaking of them in what has turned in to a ridiculous farce doing the exact opposite of what was originally intended.

    On their biggest day of the year they gather together to deny communion with Christ. Seems a odd thing for those claiming to be the only true Christians to do.

  • Bobcat
    Bobcat

    I copied below from this thread. It includes some comments regarding "until he arrives." The bolded material is directly from the Memorial outline. The rest is my commentary on those statements in the outline.

    The Lord's Evening Meal will be observed as long as Christians with the heavenly hope are on earth [Read1 Corinthians 11:26]

    Again, based on the false premise that only certain Christians were commanded to keep the ceremony.

    Ask, 'Why is this not spelled out in the NT? How do you go from the simple, "Keep doing this . . .," to the complicated 'who should/who shouldn't' that is in this outline? This smacks of a "tradition of men" that serves to nullify the clear command of God's Word. (Mt 15:3)

    In fact, the WT would have you believe that, "Keep doing this . . ." means 'Attend the Memorial meeting to passively observe.'

    Once the Lord "arrives," he will take the last of the 144,000 home to be with him in heaven (Joh 14:1-3)

    Those with the earthly hope will no longer observe the Memorial

    Will not partake of the emblems then, so do not partake now

    Where do they get this, "Will no longer observe the Memorial"? This is simply an assertion!

    "Arrives" in the NWT at 1 Cor 11:26 is the same word translated "comes" in 1 Cor 4:5. Notice what happens when "the Lord comes":

    (1 Corinthians 4:5) . . .Hence do not judge anything before the due time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring the secret things of darkness to light and make the counsels of the hearts manifest, and then each one will have his praise come to him from God.

    The 'Lord's coming' involves not just taking some to rule with him but also setting things straight among all mankind, some of whom will then "have his praise come to him from God," indicating a good outcome. This stretches the action associated with 'the Lord's coming' all the way out to the end of the 1000 year reign, after which he hands over the Kingdom to God.

    Incidentally, "until" does not necessarily have the same meaning we might normally associate with it in English. For example, Matthew 28:20 says, "I am with you until . . ." The phrase does not mean he stops being with them after "the conclusion of the age" has arrived. He is also with them during that time.

    But concerning "until he comes (or "arrives")" in 1 Cor 11:26, The New Linguistic and Exegetical Key to the Greek NT has this comment:

    Achris ("until") ou ("when") elthe (aorist subjunctive active of erchomai, "to come"). Subjunctive may have an affinity with a final clause, with the idea "until the goal is reached, that is till he comes."

    This comment, like 1 Cor 4:5, shows that the idea of Jesus' 'coming' is not just a point in time event, but involves a wide range of activity involving mankind then alive and those to be brought back to life.

    Hope this is helpful

    Take Care

    PS

    In case the above is hard to follow, think of it this way: If the memorial is in recognition of the new covenant, and the new covenant is for all those hoping to gain everlasting life (John 6:53, 54), then, it would stand to reason that the memorial will be observed until that goal is reached. The 144,000 are just a small part of a much larger picture that is effected by the giving of Jesus' 'flesh' and the 'blood of the new covenant' which the bread and wine symbolize.

  • Captain Obvious
    Captain Obvious

    Our talk had the same crap... What was interesting was he said, "we have just learned, that once the last anointed person goes up to heaven, they will no longer observe the memorial." Of course there was NO scriptural reference.

    um.. Is it... NOOO LITE?!?

    Pit still doesn't make sense.

  • Emily24
    Emily24

    I went to the memorial tonight as well and they said this same exact speil at the KH in Mid Michigan. WOW!!!

  • Billy the Ex-Bethelite
    Billy the Ex-Bethelite

    Well, they won't attend the Memorial at that future time then either, so there's no point in attending it now. We're ahead of the game by staying home instead of attending their "Reject Jesus Party."

  • WrongweektostopsniffingGlue
  • WrongweektostopsniffingGlue
    WrongweektostopsniffingGlue

    Sorry that didn't upload

  • daringhart13
    daringhart13

    Just returned from going with my elderly mother.

    Unbelievable. I don't know if I'm more shocked that I didn't lose it and start screaming......or that I seemed to be totally ambivalent.

    I just looked around as they discussed how the Memorial will go away when the last person goes to heaven.........

    Wait for it...........wait for it.........wait for it...............nope, no scripture. Just a bold assertion.

    I couldn't even muster up indignation.........I just sat there numb looking at all these poor children and one woman in a wheel chair......just sucking it all in............without nary a protest.

    My god its all so bizarre.

    I wanted to yell out: "Soylent Green!!!!"

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    If we will not partake in the future, we should not do it now. Therefore, if there will be no REJECT Astaroth Party in the future, why go now? And, as I see it, if we will not reject Astaroth in the future but will accept Her as one of the Goddesses, why not accept Her now?

  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    So in the past 2000 years there still not enough of the heavily anointed to make up 144,000 ...... really ???

    The WTS. has been getting a bit ansey recently for people who are partaking, calling them mentally diseased and so forth.

    That being the case, I would not be surprised if they did start putting a strong insinuation of not partaking on memorial night.

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