Where to begin?

by DATA-DOG 24 Replies latest jw friends

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  DATA-DOG

  Good morning everyone,

  I am drinking coffee and thinking about something that kept my tossing and turning all night. I want to tell my Wife, the Elders, my friends, that I have been watching a pattern develope within the WTBTS for years, and that I love them all but feel that tha WTBTS has become a mirror of Ancient Jerusalem when they strayed. I also want to tell them ahead of time that part of the pattern is the revisionist history being practiced.

  I thought that I would mention something about reading the older publications, and how things don't match. I expect I will get the usual responses. I really just want to ready their minds for one statement.

  1) " Mark my words, Charles Taze Russell will be completely kicked to the curb by the Society in less than six months." Or..

  2) " With the way things are headed I would not be suprised if CTR and the Bible Students are totally sidelined in six months or less."

  If I respectfully told them how I feel, making it clear that I will not support any corruption, and left the option of my attending future meetings on the table, what would they do? I have not DA'd myself. They cannot force me to meet with them. If I ask some legitimate questions about the UN and the OSCE, perhaps giving them references, and just acting like a questioning sheep, then what? They woun't be able to lie and say those things did not happen. What if I just make it clear how much I care for all of them, but then just tell them that I can't return until some things change? I would do this on a shepherding call, with my family present so that they can witnesses it all.

  Then maybe, just maybe, when CTR gets derailed like " leviathan " they might have a dim light turn on in their heads. My family is priority #1 of course, but I would love to help someone else if I can. Any thoughts or suggestions? Are there any topics that you would consider to be the least controversial? The idea is to not be combative, just concerned.

  Peace,

  DD
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  moshe

  I almost quit in 1980-81 (instead of 1988), when the WT changed it's teaching on organ transplants. I told the elders (I had sleepless nights, too)- hey wait a minute, what about all the JWs before 1980 who died, because they didn't get a kidney transplant? They were following the rules that the F&DS told them was god's rules. If they are now saying those weren't god's rules, but instead a mistaken rule from men-- Then the WT society has blood guilt on their hands for those deaths of innocent JWs. - I was questioning them why the WT never said they were sorry for any who died and didn't have to die, nor did they accept the godly consequences for their error. - After a few months the CO came to town and I cornered him, too. Let's just say that Moshe was basically told in strong language to drop it- it was the WT's way or the highway for me. I could think whatever I wanted to think in private, I just couldn't talk about it among other JWs-- as that was causing divisions and was a disfellowshipping offense. A neat trick the WT leaders employ to avoid facing a public JW tribunal of justice for their sins.
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  moshe

  D-D , I admire you for drawing a line in the sand.
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  Brother of the Hawk

  Good morning Data-Dog,

  it's funny because the wife & I were just discusing the new article with the 'New light' in it. This is my perspective, especially after learning TTATT, keeping in mind I've been an active JW for 40+ yrs. What I did was take a step back and put the mind-set of a JW back into my head and analyzed what was said; I began to realize that MY faith was based upon the foundation and teachings of Russell, Rutherford & Knorr. Knowing and believing that all 3 of these men were God's chosen 'channel' for dispensing biblical truth. With 40 years of my faith being built, being reaffirmed, I would now find it EXTREMELY difficult to accept this new light, because in essence what it is doing is destroying the foundation of a 40 year 'faith' and the very foundations this religion is based on. Talk about pulling a rug out from under your feet!

  I don't know if there are any 'thinking' JW's left, but man oh man, I would have an awful hard time swallowing this one. So perhaps, you might be able to approach your friends & family from this perspective. Because what I have learned over the years that faith is tied into your emotions. Either way my dear brother, our thoughts & prayers are with you.

  Agape

  Affectionately Brother of the Hawk [ I will never surrender my mind forever, no more ]
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  MrsCedars

  Hi Data D

  I used to think that I can say anything to my family, all my thoughts or doubts, because I was sure we had such relationship where, so long as I say things respectfully, they will understand where I’m coming from. It was all ok being disappointed with brothers, going to fewer meetings, but as soon as I said that I have doubts about the organization, all alarms go off. So now every time we talk about the subject they are on the defensive, they will defend even the most ridiculous stuff that happens within the organization and almost all conversations end with the conclusion that I am not humble enough to go with the flow, or that I don’t have strong faith or in some other way I am the problem.

  I truly hope you will have a different experience, but just wanted to say - be prepared to anything.
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  Vidqun

  Data-Dog, I have respectfully aired above concerns, about them resembling Jerusalem and the wayward Israelites, and of course their break in neutrality with the ongoing UN-OSCE affair. I was respectfully disfellowshipped for my trouble. I was extremely respectful and proved each statement from the Scriptures. The elders sat with their Sheperding-books on their laps and reached their decision in less than ten minutes. It was announced at the KH that I do not wish to be a JW anymore. Thus I was kicked out = disfellowshipped and is now known as an apostate. You will find that there is absolutely no tolerance for freedom of speech nor thinking amongst the elders of JWs. As MrsCedars said: If that's the way you want to go, "Be prepared for anything."
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  whathappened

  Yes, these fine people are correct. Be prepared for anything. You may help some honest hearted person out, others will dig their heels in deeper. That is what happened in our family.

  To thine own self be true. Do what you think best.

  We will be here for you.
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  Oubliette

  DD,

  With all due respect, you're suffering from the delusion that doctrines, "accurate knowlege" or truth matter to those that run this religion. They do not.

  Have you heard this slogan: "Listen, Obey and Be Blessed!"
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  OnTheWayOut

  I was eating up all the Watchtower stuff when I came in and got baptized in 1988. The changes over the years were pretty minimal at that time except for the increased attitude toward the disfellowshipped and disassociated. And being a newbie, I was convinced that this was necessary as the end was getting so close.

  So 1995's change in "generation" really threw me for a loop. I was a brand-spanking-new elder, having been a total yes-man up until then. When I said something about the shock of such a huge change, another elder brushed it off and said "Things change."

  Oh, I lingered another 10 years before waking up. But the changes since then have just been humongous. If I were still there, I would have laughed out loud and followed with a "What the......?" at the overlap generation doctrine.

  But I have learned that nobody really knows what CTR preached and said. Nobody really knows what he said about pyramids and 1874 and 1914 and miracle wheat and all that stuff. Heck, the average member doesn't know much about 1975 or the U.N. involvement or anything Ray Franz brought up in CRISIS OF CONSCIENCE. They just know their mantra: "The light is getting brighter as the day draws near."

  The "PROCLAIMERS" book that everybody has forgotten by now would be their reference to anything in their past. They will just say that anything you mentioned was admitted in that book. "That was covered and we moved forward to a better understanding since then." I would not waste my breath and energy trying to point out changes and discrepancies.
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  AnnOMaly

  For reference, some thought-provoking quotes below.

  Regarding the very first issue of Zion's Watch Tower (p. 3):

  w87 3/1 pp. 11-12 par. 7 ‘Upon the Watchtower I Am Standing’

  July 1879 saw the birth of Russell’s principal vehicle for Bible enlightenment —Zion’s Watch Tower and Herald of Christ’s Presence. Its first issue laid out the magazine’s noble purpose: “As its name indicates, it aims to be the lookout from whence matters of interest and profit may be announced to the ‘little flock,’ and as the ‘Herald of Christ’s Presence,’ to give the ‘meat in due season’ to the ‘household of faith.’”

  In the early 1920s, the issue of who was the 'faithful and discreet slave' was 'conclusively settled.' The Watch Tower Society, under Russell's supervision was God's 'channel.'

  w.1923 3/1 p. 67-8, 72, Loyalty the Test

  5 The fact of our Lord's second coming is definitely settled by the Scriptures. (John 14: 2, 3; Acts 1: 11; 2 Timothy 4: 8) The Scriptures show that his second presence was due in 1874. (See C83-127.) Also it is definitely settled by his own words, that at the time of his second presence he would gird himself, cause his servants to sit down to meat, and would come forth and serve them. (Luke 12: 37) He also firmly establishes the fact that during his presence he would conduct a harvest work (Matthew 13: 18-40; 24: 31); and with equal force he states that at that time he would appoint some one to the office of that "faithful and wise servant" and make him ruler over all his goods. (Matthew 24: 45-47) These points are incontrovertible; therefore must be considered by all reasonable and fair-minded Christians as conclusively settled.

  [ ...]

  8 We believe that all who are now rejoicing in present truth will concede that Brother Russell faithfully filled the office of special servant of the Lord; and that he was made ruler over all the Lord's goods.

  [ ... ]

  48 If, then, we believe that the Lord is present, conducting his harvest work and the setting up of his kingdom; if he chose Brother Russell as his "faithful and wise servant" and made him ruler or overseer of his goods; and if Brother Russell, acting under the Lord's supervision, organized the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society as a vehicle or channel to carry on the proclamation of the message of his kingdom and the feeding of his sheep (thereby looking after the interests of his kingdom), then the conclusion must be that this is the Lord's way. After a careful and prayerful review of all the facts in the light of the Scriptures, can any consecrated, anointed follower of Jesus say that this is not the Lord's way? If this is not the Lord's way, then what is the Lord's way ? And if the Lord has any other way, that way should be made known, and that way all his followers should go.

  49 If the way here pointed out is the Lord's way of carrying on his work, then fighting against it or repudiating it is fighting against or repudiating the Lord, because the way is not of man but of the Lord. We repeat, that failing or refusing to work (trade with talents) the Lord's way is disloyalty to the Lord. No one can justly take any offense at these conclusions, because it is not arrogating to any man or men any superiority, but is giving all the glory and honor to the Lord, who carries out his purposes in his own good and orderly way.