Build it and Make Them Come

by OnTheWayOut 10 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  OnTheWayOut

  It's the same old story with Watchtower, even at the local level.

  My mother has to drive a slightly uncomfortable distance to her Kingdom Hall in affluent suburbia. She doesn't mind because the neighborhoods are nice and she sticks to main streets, but she is coming home by herself late on Thursday night. (She is married to an unbeliever.) Her Kingdom Hall is beautiful, been remodeled a few times sparing no expenses and is fully paid for. There's typically 3 congregations (2 foreign language) using the hall.

  Well, another congregation in another affluent suburban area even further away has an old Kingdom Hall that's also fully paid for with the same typical 3 congregations. (I say "typical" because over several years, the numbers change when those congregations relocate for various reasons.) The folks at that Kingdom Hall could easily swallow the cost of remodeling, even at Watchtower's inflated costs for the volunteers.

  BUT NO!

  Someone in their infinite wisdom of forethought wants to sell these two properties and roll the money over into buying new land that they can build a huge double (or more) Kingdom Hall on. Of course, they would have to take out a new loan from WTS to finance the massive building.

  I imagine for it's age, my mother's hall is owned by the local congregation. Probably true of the other hall.

  When it's built halfway between the areas, my mother would have to drive at least twice as far to stay in her congregation. I suggested she drive the opposite way (east) to a completely different hall that would be closer than that, but still further than her current hall. She hesitated because that one is not in the most affluent suburbs, but then she thought about it and figured she might go south, instead of west or east, to yet another older hall that is bought and paid for. Then she went through the agonizing cult thinking that it wasn't really what "the brothers" would want. I am pretty sure she will go back and forth on this for years, regardless of where she actually drives.

  At least she talks to me about her life and her JW problems and listened when I told her she is free to raise questions and ask about "just staying where we are happy" when the congregation uses their local needs time to discuss this. NO- she won't raise her hand and question the brothers. But she will remember what I said when she sees them just railroad this plan through for the good of the organization.
• 

  DesirousOfChange

  I don't understand the of the WTS wanting every Cong to build new KHalls and be in debt to them at a time they expect "this system of things" to worsen. What IF the economy collapses? Unskilled JWs could easily be the first and most affected and now how do they pay back the money to the WTS?

  Plus, by the WTS taking claim to the property doesn't this increase their liability?

  Doc
• 

  life is to short

  They are doing the same thing with my husband's hall. There is noting wrong with the halls but they just want a bigger building and they claim the parking is bad at both halls so with a new hall 'the parking would be so much better.'

  Both halls they want to get rid of are totally paid for and like you said they will now go into debt to the WTS with the new one.

  My husband and I were out to lunch last Sunday and we run into this sister at the restaurant who goes to the other hall that will share the building with my husband hall. She is a totally over bearing person and when I saw here my appetite vanished. So much for a nice lunch out.

  She does not know I am out of the religion and she was just gushing over the new hall and how Jehovah was directing it yad, yad, yad , I just looked at her and started to say why in the world with all the brothers in such poor country's would Jehovah bless us with a new hall when our halls are in great shape and there is nothing wrong with them. Wouldn't it be so much better to send the money that will be used to build this new hall over to these poor country's so that our bothers and sisters there can at the very least have a hall.

  She quickly had to leave and never answered me.

  LITS
• 

  zed is dead

  I think they are doing a money grab, pure and simple.

  zed
• 

  ABibleStudent

  It is too bad that the WTBTS's latest real estate scam is not illegal. Mind control is so powerful it makes intelligent and caring people to not question getting taken by con-artists.

  Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

  Robert
• 

  Mad Sweeney

  This thread wasn't about what I had hoped.

  But yeah, it's a shame how the Borg railroads the local congregations into keeping their Regional Building Racket going.
• 

  AndDontCallMeShirley

  "I don't understand the of the WTS wanting every Cong to build new KHalls and be in debt to them at a time they expect "this system of things" to worsen."

  Exactly! If you want to know whether or not the governing body REALLY believes Armageddon is as close as they claim, just look at all the building and expanding the WT Society is doing. Actions speak louder than words.

  The WT is obviously in it for the long haul. If they truly believed Armageddon was imminent then they'd realize that any building projects right now are a complete waste of time. The US Branch projects will take several years to complete. Rather than make do with the current situation and concentrate on using resources to reach as many as possible, being that Armageddon is so close, the WT instead does what it has always done: deepen it's foothold in 'Satan's system of things'.

  The WT is continuing to build its real estate empire on the backs of the rank and file. What OnTheWayOut is describing is part of that grand plan. No doubt those older properties have a lot of equity built up in them, and the WT likes to sell them off, make a large profit (which goes to Brooklyn), then start the same process over again with new properties. Meanwhile, all the expenses for this wheeling-and-dealing is placed on the average JW- who has no say in any of it.
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  OnTheWayOut

  Plus, by the WTS taking claim to the property doesn't this increase their liability?

  Adding to what Shirley addresses, let's break it down. Say two older Kingdom Halls are worth a half-million dollars apiece. They sell these and buy a nice piece of land for close to a million dollars. No gain so far.

  The new group of congregations borrow money from WTS to build a Kingdom Hall. With their paperwork arrangements, WTS will actually own this new property and building. So far they made a million dollars, the cost of the land. Their money is tied up in the building, but it's their building so that looks like a wash, but is it?

  Next, their faithful buddies on the Regional Building Committee are "hired" to build the Kingdom Hall. There's plenty of debate on whether there is dishonesty in the prices charged for their expertise and equipment, but let us just assume they are not told to overcharge and they never over order extra materials for use on their own projects. Even assuming that, these faithful buddies are breaking even and getting paid, so that their businesses can remain successful and their equipment is paid for.

  At the beginning of construction, WTS locks it's money into builders and supplies. That makes the money less liquid, less likely to be taken away from them by lawsuits or changes in governmental laws. Yes, this is the opposite of what they are doing in Brooklyn, but that's vast amounts of money being freed up and Kingdom Hall buildings are peanuts in comparison. Plus they are making money down the road.

  The locals already lost their million dollars that they paid for the 2 old halls. Now they have a new debt somewhere under a million for the new building. So WTS gets these folks to borrow money to pay for a construction that the lender will keep when it's paid off. For the price of construction, WTS gets a property that is worth between 1.5 and 2 million dollars. And it cost them nothing.

  Even if the initial 2 Kingdom Halls were their own property, and this were done, WTS would get a newer, more valuable property out of the deal.
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  AndDontCallMeShirley

  Let's not forget Menlo Park, Ca. congregation.

  As I understand it, part of that issue was that the WT Society/RBC estimates for an unnecessary remodel the BOE decided against, but was forced on them, came in 2-3 times higher than what it would've cost if the cong. had hired a commercial firm to do the same work. Considering that the cong. is paying only for materials, labor is free, the only explanation would be that some local brothers and the WT were making a profit off the remodel.

  As OnTheWayOut correctly stated, the money from any KH or Ass Hall that is sold does not get used to fund the next project locally. 100% of all money goes back to WT headquarters. The local JWs always start from a zero balance point. WT keeps 100% of the money. The arrangement is really a cash cow for WT.
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  Look at it this way: The average congregation members contribute a little bit of money to the worldwide work. But if the congregation in a new building has a "mortgage bill" to pay, the pressure is on everyone to contribute more.

  The real money used to be in "selling" literature. Now, it's in real estate.