Dumb line in Bible Study presentation in July 2013 KM

by Richard_I 17 Replies latest jw friends

  • Richard_I
    Richard_I

    in the July 2013 KM for the presentation to start a study, this is the recommended presentation: "Almost everyone prays at one time or another. Even atheists have prayed when in trouble. Do you think that God listens to all prayers?"

    Why did they include this line about athiests? If a jw encounters an athiest, the athiest is gonna stop them right there and tell them how disrespectful that is. That line is only there to start an argument, really, it serves no purpose other than upset people.

    Can you imagine someone coming up to you and saying, "Everyone prays! Even athiests pray when they're about to die!" Very confrontational.

  • Julia Orwell
    Julia Orwell

    I prayed once when I was an atheist. I prayed saying, "God, if you're real, reveal yourself to me." I was 12 years old...

    But most people become atheists from choice after having considered God, whereas I was raised that way.

    Perhaps a better way of putting that presentation would be, "I've heard that some atheists have been known to pray..." by using "I" statements and distancing yourself from the information by saying "I've heard...been known to..." that's how I would have worded it for a presentation when I was in. Not that I used their presentations anyway because I thought they were dumb.

  • blondie
    blondie

    Even atheists have prayed when in trouble. Do you think that God listens to all prayers?"

    -----------

    Because the WTS teaches that God does not listen to all prayers.

    *** bh Bible Teach book chap. 17 pp. 166-167 pars. 5-8 Draw Close to God in Prayer ***

    5 Does Jehovah listen to all prayers? Consider what he told rebellious Israelites in the days of the prophet Isaiah: “Even though you make many prayers, I am not listening; with bloodshed your very hands have become filled.” (Isaiah 1:15) So certain actions can cause God not to listen to our prayers. For our prayers to be favorably heard by God, therefore, we must meet some basic requirements.

    6 A primary requirement is that we exercise faith. (Mark 11:24) The apostle Paul wrote: “Without faith it is impossible to please [God] well, for he that approaches God must believe that he is and that he becomes the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him.” (Hebrews 11:6) Having true faith is more than merely knowing that God exists and that he hears and answers prayers. Faith is proved by our actions. We must give clear evidence that we have faith by the way we live every day.—James 2:26.

    7 Jehovah also requires that those who approach him in prayer do so with humility and sincerity. Do we not have reason to be humble when speaking to Jehovah? When people have the opportunity to speak to a king or a president, they usually do so respectfully, acknowledging the ruler’s high position. How much more so should we be respectful when approaching Jehovah! (Psalm 138:6) After all, he is “God Almighty.” (Genesis 17:1) When we pray to God, the manner in which we approach him should show that we humbly recognize our position before him. Such humility will also move us to pray from our heart in sincerity, avoiding routine, repetitive prayers.—Matthew 6:7, 8.

    8 Another requirement for being heard by God is that we act in harmony with our prayers. Jehovah expects us to do all that is within our power to work at what we pray for. For example, if we pray, “Give us today our bread for this day,” we must work hard at whatever available job we are able to perform. (Matthew 6:11; 2 Thessalonians 3:10) If we pray for help in overcoming a fleshly weakness, we must be careful to avoid circumstances and situations that could lead us into temptation. (Colossians 3:5) In addition to these basic requirements, there are questions about prayer that we need to have answered.

    *** w90 5/15 pp. 11-12 Fear Jehovah, the Hearer of Prayer ***

    A Restricted Privilege

    6 Human kings do not allow just anyone to enter into the royal palace unannounced. An audience with a king is a restricted privilege. So is prayer to the King of eternity. Of course, those approaching him through Jesus Christ with proper appreciation of God’s glorious majesty can expect to be heard. The King Eternal must be approached with a reverent, worshipful attitude. And those desiring to be heard must display “the fear of Jehovah.”—Proverbs 1:7.

    7 What is “the fear of Jehovah”? It is profound reverence for God, coupled with a wholesome dread of displeasing him. This awe stems from deep gratitude for his loving-kindness and goodness. (Psalm 106:1) It involves acknowledging him as the King of eternity, who has the right and the power to bring punishment, including death, upon anyone disobeying him. Persons manifesting the fear of Jehovah may pray to him with the expectation of being heard.

    8 Naturally, God does not answer the prayers of wicked, unfaithful, and self-righteous people. (Proverbs 15:29; Isaiah 1:15; Luke 18:9-14) But those who fear Jehovah are heard because they have conformed to his righteous standards. Yet, they have done more. Fearers of Jehovah have made a dedication to God in prayer and symbolized this by undergoing water baptism. They thus have an unrestricted privilege of prayer.

    9 To be heard by God, a person must express prayerful sentiments that are in harmony with the divine will. Yes, he must be sincere, but more is required. “Without faith it is impossible to please [God] well,” wrote the apostle Paul, “for he that approaches God must believe that he is and that he becomes the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him.” (Hebrews 11:6) Well, then, can unbaptized persons be encouraged to pray with the hope of being heard?

    10 Aware that prayer is a restricted privilege, King Solomon asked that Jehovah hear only foreigners who prayed toward God’s temple in Jerusalem. (1 Kings 8:41-43) Centuries later, the Gentile foreigner Cornelius “made supplication to God continually” as a devout man. Upon gaining accurate knowledge, Cornelius dedicated himself to God, who then gave him the holy spirit. Following this, Cornelius and other Gentiles were baptized. (Acts 10:1-44) Like Cornelius, anyone today progressing toward dedication may be encouraged to pray. But an individual who is insincere about studying the Scriptures, does not know the divine requirements for prayer, and has not yet displayed an attitude pleasing to God cannot be said to fear Jehovah, have faith, or be earnestly seeking him. Such a person is not in position to offer prayers acceptable to God.

    11 Some who were at one time progressing toward dedication later may seem to be holding back. If they do not have enough love for God in their heart to make an unreserved dedication to him, they ought to ask themselves whether they still have the wonderful privilege of prayer. Apparently not, because those approaching God must be earnestly seeking him and also righteousness and meekness. (Zephaniah 2:3) Everyone who really fears Jehovah is a believer who makes a dedication to God and symbolizes it by getting baptized. (Acts 8:13; 18:8) And only baptized believers have an unrestricted privilege of approaching the King Eternal in prayer.

  • hamsterbait
    hamsterbait

    They are not even interested in what the householder thinks.

    See the Kingdumb Misery: " [allow for comment] then carry on as if they hadnt said anything."

    Witnesses are now saying they are not here to debate, but simply to preach. (So shut up and listen.)

    HB

  • wha happened?
    wha happened?

    They are not even interested in what the householder thinks.

    They really don't have a clue about world/current events, even if they cared. One of the most embarressing things I had to endure, was my ex wife making a presentation at the door. Starting with a faulty baseless line from the WT, moving on to her interpretation of the news and world events, to her offer of the mag, it was the most humiliating, ignorant conversation "starter" I had to endure. All the while, maintaining that stupid grin on my face so people could see that Jehovah's people are a happy people.

    We preached in areas that were financially well to do, which meant they likely had an education beyond homeschooling, and GED's. Most were kind and simply said "NO thank u." Others had a little fun and I can't say I blame then.

  • AndDontCallMeShirley
    AndDontCallMeShirley

    I had a similar experience to wha happened?

    When Ross Perot was running for President, I was out in field service with another pioneer. The pioneer started his presentation by mentioning the presidential candidate, "Ross Perot", only he pronounced it "Parrot".

    Householder: "who?"

    JW: "Ross Parrot"

    HH: "it's pronounced 'peh-row'"!

    JW: proceeds with his presentation unfazed

    HH: "is this guy retarded?". Brain's protective "idiot alert" engages thus preventing ears from hearing anything further said by JW.

    I could've died! How disconnected do you have to be from current events to not know that basic piece of information?

    Undoubtedly another graduate of the WT University- you know, the "best" education available where you get the equivilent of a four-year college degree just by reading the Watchtower and Awake?

  • punkofnice
    punkofnice

    It's just mnd control propaganda to try to prove (without any supporting evidence), that everyone KNOWS the JWs are right but just deny it to live an evil, selfish life.

    'Atheist' is used to pigeon hole people into a specific group that doesn't even exist. Just like the loaded language term 'apostate(TM)'.

    Propoganda!

  • wha happened?
    wha happened?

    I could've died! How disconnected do you have to be from current events to not know that basic piece of information?

    Because rather than watching or listening to any news source, they chose to watch another episode of "Friends". Conversations at meeting for field service rarely centered around world events, short of 911. and even so, that conversation was full of folklore and rumour. But bring up last night's episode of House, and watch the conversation light up.

    Jehovah's Witnesses, bringing Idiocracy to the world, one high school drop out at a time

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    Householder: "who?"

    JW: "Ross Parrot"

    HH: "it's pronounced 'peh-row'"!

    JW: proceeds with his presentation unfazed

    HH: "is this guy retarded?".

    It would have been hilarious if the HH had said "That dog don't hunt!" followed by "is this guy retarded?" in Ross Perot's accent.

  • DATA-DOG
    DATA-DOG

    Do the GB want to stir up trouble like the Westboro Baptist Church? Then they can go to court and get a precedent set? That seems like a win in the long term for the WTBT$. In the short term, the local KH is unified by Brother Dumas A. Stone getting his a** kicked, or threatened in service.

    It is a proven fact that extremely strong bonds are formed due to shared suffering. It works for the Seals, it works for the JW's.. It may even contribute to many of us here tolerating each other.

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