Next Of Kin - your JW family will REFUSE BLOOD if you need it... (page 2)

talesin

Thanks .. all , for bringing this BTT.

It's very simple, actually ...... just make sure that your NOK is a person that will not deny your right to LIVE

xo

tal

return of parakeet

This is an problem that every exdub must worry about if they still have dub family connections.

For instance, if you let your children visit your dub parents for a weekend, what assurance do you have that in an emergency in which there is no time to call you, your parents will not withhold consent for a blood transfusion? It's a slim chance, to be sure, but still one to consider.

I always sweated bullets when my young son visited his dub grandparents. I made sure I was close to the phone the whole time. It's a crime that we have to worry like this.

Xanthippe

Thanks Justitia.

Band on the Run

May I add a few comments. I face the same basic issue. Several Eastern states have fairly simple forms for designation of a health care proxy and advanced medical directives. Where I have lived, one can add pages that detail your life style philosophy and even describe your fears of how family members will trounce on your express wishes. When cases started to appear in courts, ambiguity or vagueness were the problem s. Judges want to order what the person wanted but if your wishes are not clear, they cannot ask you.

You don't need to appoint anyone in NY or PA. Many people don't trust anyone. You can order what you want and your beliefs in great detail. Practicioners in the area suggested broad language when you are young but as you age or become ill, do extensive research about the pros and cons of procedures. This is scary but worth the trauma. Your directive should be more detailed.

A lawyer is not enough. Hospitals will not know who your lawyer is when you are unconscious. You should give every health professional a copy. Put copies on file at local hospitals. Carry one on your person. Make a wallet card stating where the original signed and notarized original is. MDs have to make split second decisions. They will honor your wishes-if they know what they are. I find this last part the hardest to do. I am all right at this moment. I don't want to reveal private family horror. There are so many more. pressing concerns. My laziness might consign me to living hell.

.

blondie

Yes, the HC-POA is not an invention of the WTS...many non-jws fail to see the need for it, but once you go through the medical procedures open to you, you might not want some of them or you might and you want to make sure you have someone on your side.

Justitia Themis

Where I have lived, one can add pages that detail your life style philosophy and even describe your fears of how family members will trounce on your express wishes. When cases started to appear in courts, ambiguity or vagueness were the problem s. Judges want to order what the person wanted but if your wishes are not clear, they cannot ask you.

Actually, detailed POAs are increasing the legal issues, not decreasing them. The more detailed the writing and the more issues it covers the more it is subject to attack for ambiguity and changed circumstances. That is precisely why there is a movement in health care adminstration and law away from more detailed POAs.

A detailed POA will be considered a respresentation of your wishes only if it was completed within the prior few years and your life has remained stable in the interim. It's actually quite intuitive to have such a presumption. People's lives, opinions, and circumstances change with time, and that impacts their wishes.

In sum, a person can 1) have a less detailed POA, and update the agent as to his/her wishes, in which case the POA will control (except over a court-appointed guardian), or 2) execute a detailed POA, and update it every few years to avoid the very real chance that it will be disregarded.

The option BOTR is referring to is likely the POLST. When facing the end-of-life decisions, a person AND HIS OR HER DOCTOR can meet to discuss the options and choices. In such a case, you are not appointing someone else to make a decision for you. You and your physician are discussing it, and your physician is actually creating 'doctors orders' in advance. My homestate is on the forefront of this movement; however, the POLST is not proving effective because emergency personnel and hospitals are refusing the follow them for fear of liability. Who knows if the patient even sees the doctor that allegedly signed the POLST, or if a family member forged the document.

http://www.nj.com/times-opinion/index.ssf/2013/04/opinion_nj_polst_form_provides.html

That right was secured when a 2011 law, signed by Gov. Chris Christie, allowed for the new Practitioner Orders for Life Sustaining Treatment (POLST) form.

Band on the Run

Justitia,

Grow up. There are several seasoned lawyers here who are fed up with you. Personally, my take is that you need seasoning. It is very clear to others that if I say x, and add personal commentary you cannot refute, you will say Y and why make personal view is horrible. I am willing to name the members but I will not without their permission.

I abhor your politics and what you will do with law. A few bad actors such as yourself can destroy decades of hard work my the many. I assume you don't like my politics.

Grow up. We are both women. You are still not even a beginning lawyer. Where I trained and live, civility is important. I can celebrate your accomplishments without agreeing with you.

Simon prob. needs money. Why don't we stage a public cat right and sell tickets. The proceeds can go to the former JW org of our choice. If you want war, we can wage war. I don't have to put much time in b//c others are even more fed up with you than I am. Civility. I get personal invitations to Federalist Society events.

You have a different view on everything that I post. No matter the subject matter. I grew up in the Newark, NJ so I don't need any fancy education to see what is at work. Other lawyers have granted you leeway. She is new. Life will teach her. We have very opposing views. I will meet you at any trial or appellate court any day. In fact, all of the top tier law school grads and law partners will meet you and conquer you. Some of the lower tier can see how we trounce outrageous people. Don't nit pick. If you want a battle, engage in battle.

Others may not realize what is happening here. FYI, law is not static. A brief skim of law review articles, treatises etc. should show a range of opinions. Justitia represents perhaps 4% of the bar. She has an agenda. I note it. I have an agenda, too, but I will clearly state my agenda.

This is such little girl, playground stuff. I will not sanitize this post. If you must put down everything I write, let us at least make money from the fight. Now I have to call all the other lawyers who are fed up. Furthermore, others with no legal background see what you do. Don't think I spend my private time talking about you. They volunteer the information.

Yes, I will always have an East Coast progressive agenda. I am proud of out. Whatever your full agenda is, you should be proud, too. So don't nit pick. Just say what you really think. She intends to practice and defend hospitals and insurers against ordinary people. There are so many neutral better uses of a degree. One day you may be the victim of gross malpractice.

So fight but can't we donate funds generated to a good charity? Of course, your own pocket is prob. your charity. I am no great liberal. My lifestyle has been funded by representing multinational corporations and foreign governments against others at the same level. Few Wall St. partners would ever practice law if they had to mess with ordinary people. I would be the first out the door but there would a crush at the door.

Also, this is JWN. People love cat fights here. Popcorn images abound.

Fight me and you will mess with the best of Harvard and Yale. I truly believe that the whole forum will not enjoy it.

Band on the Run

P.S. Has bar review not started in your area? Spend time debating me here now and you may not pass. It has happened to better people than you. Also, it has happened to far smarter people than you. If you have never studied in your life, now is the time to study. Don't go department store shopping. Don't watch classic films. Hit those bar review books. Now is the time to study or Justitia Themis will never practice law after three years of law school.

talesin

Scully, that's a good point. I had the 'conversation' with my friend. We've been friends for a long time, so she is well aware of the JWS tactics. I do need to get going on POA and DNR orders, though.

I'm sure regulations and necessary actions differ by country, and states. Urging all to attend to this life-or-death matter.

xo

tal

Justitia Themis

It is very clear to others that if I say x, and add personal commentary you cannot refute, you will say Y and why make personal view is horrible.

BOTR, the facts speak otherwise.

I haven't even made a general post after one of your comments for eight months, since this thread: http://jehovahs-witness.net/members/private/239464/1/Churches-Politics-and-Taxation-Poll I have responded when you have posted on a thread I started.

Additionally, your civil rights experience is irrelevant in the health care legal arena. After spending the last two years studying health care legal subjects, including interning with hospital general counsel, I can say unequivocally that your assertion that 'more detail is always better' in the context of health-care POAs is outdated, legally incorrect, and possibly damaging to those on the forum.

Good day.

Next Of Kin - your JW family will REFUSE BLOOD if you need it...

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