Good Friend of mine gets a response to his letter about Russell...

by confusedandalone 11 Replies latest jw experiences

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  confusedandalone

  So a good friend of mine who had an issue with the fact that Charles Taze Russell was given the understanding of 2520 and 1914 etc.. and was not of the faithful slave. He asked how could it be possible that Jah would bless someone who was not part of his organization to have such understanding after reading the July 15 WT. He read me the letter as a way to help me understand and accept the Watchtower. He seems to be fine with the response. He is an ex-elder / Bethelite as well. Really nice guy but I can see that this change has screwed with his head.

  Well they actually admit a few things I would not expect:

  1. Although Jesus stated the faithful slave would be the channel in the last days it does not mean that JEHOVAH did not use other individuals and groups as channels of communication. It goes on to say he used the guys who wrote the christian greek scriptures and that he also used John or something to that effect.

  2. He said that others also calculated the "seven times" (not of the slave) and the date of 19141 such as someone named Steely he says blah blah blah.

  3. He also said that it quotes that many of te russellites doctrines were not unique. Others before them had reached the same conclusions from their study of the bible. such as rejecting trinity and hellfire etc.. or the using OF THE NAME JEHOVAH.

  So after sharing with me high points he says that "I should now see that my concerns when we talked about these things earlier were unfounded and that an answer came in due season.......................................

  ..........................................................................................................................

  This guy is sharp, he is not one to be rolled over - or so I thought. I guess it really takes something traumatic to get people to see it for what it is.
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  AndersonsInfo

  confusedandalone: What a revealing letter your friend received from Writing Correspondence. So this is the way that the present-day "spokesmen for Jehovah" are going to overcome what we former-JW have been saying on the Internet and in books -- that Russell wasn't the first one to reveal all that “progressive revelation” or new "truths" he presented in his literature.

  WT writers are so transparent. We know what they are doing – Reacting to books, books presently published and more coming with lots of proof that all along Russell was nothing but a pretentious talker pushing old religious ideas that flopped, primarily about the second coming of Christ and the end of the world. They think if they admit the truth (using half-truths), it will save their organization. They should think again because it won't work. Time has run out for them and their lies. And I’m of the opinion that they are the ones to put the last nail in their own WT coffin by admitting what we have known all along and which many of us have been disfellowshipped for saying.

  Wow, this is great! We have forced them to admit that we have been right all along - Russell copied his religion from lots of 18 th- and 19 th -century folks!

  Incidentally, I've been calling the religion of JWs a "Re-Run" religion for quite some time but didn’t know that the WT agreed with me.

  Russell should be known not for inventing a new American religion but for regenerating the failure of those old apocalyptic millenarian religious ideas! He was a windbag that really offered nothing new, nothing of substance, only failure of fantasy ideas just as those in Russell's past offered and so is the group he founded still doing 132-years later.

  I’m going to utter prophesy: And I’m confident that I’m right. I foresee that it won't be long now when the Watchtower’s Writing Correspondence’s reply to your friend will actually become a Watchtower magazine study article. Oh, this is going to be fun to watch!
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  Julia Orwell

  More and more jws will write on this matter n receive that answer, so I think you must be right. I reckon this change will he like the 1995 one: a real watershed, but we may not see the full impact for maybe 5 years.
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  confusedandalone

  I am going to beg for him to let me have a copy of it... it is really pitiful that as stated above 130+ years later they admit that the guy who started this whole religion that was so cuting edge and had gods blessing from thes start actually was just based on stuff that he got from other people who evidently jehovah used to reveal info to... its getting so convoluted now.

  " Wow, this is great! We have forced them to admit that we have been right all along - Russell copied his religion from lots of 18 th- and 19 th -century folks!" - I read your experience awhile back. Like you I went to Bethel but didn't serve anywhere near as long as you. I also washed toilets almost the entire time. I dreaaaaaaaaaaaaamed of being in the writing department. Then my overseer who was in cleaning who was one of the most arrogant bastards I have ever met got sent there. I though, "How could Jehovah do this???" Please tell me - did you find everyone so arrogant. The way they write these letters its as if you have no choice but to all of a sudden realize that it's elementary and that I was the only one out of the loop.
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  biometrics

  I grew up as a JW. The first time I heard anything of Russell's 1914 pyramidology theories was through a brother in the early 1990s. I was about 17. He wasn't a conventional JW by any means, and he wasn't brought up in the truth (I think he's no longer a JW).

  We were out witlessing when the topic of CTR and 1914 came up during conversation. He said something like "He went a bit wacky with pyramidology". That phrase stuck with me for 15 years until the internet came of age.

  Whenever talking to JW's about "Old light" I like to use Luke 8:17 - "For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open."
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  confusedandalone

  bio - i never cared to know much about him. I just am kind of fabergasted at the fact that they can easily admit that he just borrowed everything from a bunch of other guys and the whole 2520 and 1914 thing isnt unique. When we tell people in service we are the only people who have this unique understanding and its what sets us apart...
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  Band on the Run

  Why were my sincere letters for explanation from the Writing Department never answered? I am not joking.

  It sounds as tho CTR is going to be kicked out completely soon. There will be sudden new light that he was actually an apostate.

  This shows how long you can sit in KH and not know fundamental things. I thought CTR was the FDS. Who else could possibly be FDS if not Russell? My mom explained that the Witnesses were very different during Russell's time when our family became involved. Many family members rejected Rutherford. This was very ancient history to me when I was young. If I had CTR timelines, occult, Masonic, and pyramidology in my background, I would start rewriting history. To be fair, every religion has a CTR who must be denied plausibly.

  It is a huge sign how the Witnesses transform their message. There was much more respect for CTR, despite the old fashioned and weird reasoning than for Rutherford.

  Part of me enjoys watching the special few senior GB and associates who go on national TV or comment publicly about the faith. It is such BS. I was amazed when I arrived here at how similar almost all posters' experiences were to my own. I thought I had a weird perception. The parodies could not work unless there were not fundamental truths behind them. How does everyone know how the brothers in my KH spoke or observe their body language. It is scary. When they speak, I have no clue at all that we once belonged to the same religion. I can't explain to people how what they hear is so different from reality. I also watch for outright deception and fraud. They don't outright lie - not so far as I know. It shows the power of messaging and framing issues the way you want.

  I've seen others reframe issues and stay on message but the Witnesses seem to excel at it.
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  oppostate

  I've seen others reframe issues and stay on message but the Witnesses seem to excel at it.

  Yup! I agree, just like the Pharisees of old they are the masters of hypocrisy and double-talk.

  How do you know the WTS is reframing issues and twisting the Bible to suit their agenda?

  When they publish anything. Bunch of vipers in the writing dept. to start with!
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  tootired2care

  Wow, this really sickens me.

  So pondering the points above it really has confirmed that it's now open season on Russell. I suspect the next phase of their schemes is to tarball up the false predictions and dodgy doctrine and pin it on Russell and then dissavow him as a "true JW" (tm). If they are going to do this to Russell why not Rutherford, Knorr etc? Call it hubris if you will, but they must be very confident that all the RF will focus on is the preaching and the increasing numbers and they will accept this. By pulling this CIA style move, I believe they are going to make it more difficult for us to reason with our family members.

  Perhaps this July 15th watchtower was a test of the waters of just how gulluble their members are, and based on the letter it looks like they are confident to proceed with divorcing their past perhaps even up to 1980, and what's more is the majority will probably accept it.

  Folks they have been masters of manipulation and have been able to pull it off for 130 years,. In the next few years prepare to watch a coverup happen that will rival the NSA scandal. There is no doubt that this is now a full blown cult of the highest order.
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  jwfacts

  Although Jesus stated the faithful slave would be the channel in the last days it does not mean that JEHOVAH did not use other individuals and groups as channels of communication.

  So they are already watering down the new doctrine. Previously, it was said that the slave had continued for 1900 years, with Russell a continuation. However, no one could be proven to be the slave immediately prior to Russell. Now they claim the slave started in 1919, but with a dotted line to other individuals that almost had it right. They are trying to have the best of both worlds.

  Russell should be known not for inventing a new American religion but for regenerating the failure of those old apocalyptic millenarian religious ideas!

  Very good point. Russell regenerated Miller's prophecy, after Miller walked away from it, admitting he was wrong. Other Adventists did the same, and most have also tried to distance themselves now. There is a limited life span for the 1914 doctrine, as it is not a year that will be of any relevance to people born in the 21st century.