Help needed: JC standards/questions for "Drunkenness"

by respectful_observer 24 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  BluesBrother

  As has been said, there are no set set of questions. Much will depend on the individual case . Has he has been counselled in recent times for alcahol consumption? How serious was the intoxication ? Has he done it more than once?

  He does have the right to have his accuser face him. If he denies how serious it was then two witness are required.

  If he accepts the charge and confesses it then he must state his utter remorse and repentance without any self justification

  That is the best I can do, Good luck to him.
• 

  undercover

  Are there two or more 'witnesses' to the alleged drunkeness? If not, it didn't happen...as long as he doesn't confess. No confession, no witnesses, they can't do anything...technically. Oh they may not believe him and they'll watch him like a hawk from now on, even digging around his so-called friends looking for snitches. But they won't be able to DF him, or even reprove him. They'll give him a warning, may even play good cop/bad cop on him, but if he knows it's all BS, doesn't really fear these guys, he can lie and pretend his way through it and walk out and be sitting in the bar/pub by 9pm.

  Of course, if there are two or more witnesses, then just claim it as a one time slip. He's embarrassed and apologizes for upsetting everyone. Crocidile tear it up... and on yeah - the first thing he did after he realized he had messed up? He prayed to Jehovah asking forgiveness and help. They fall for that shit.
• 

  slimboyfat

  What a good thread.

  The wording of the elders' manual would seem to suggest that a key factor in the JC will be whether the drunkeness was "notorious" or not. Reputation is everything for the Watchtower. They don't care so much what was done or who was hurt, just if it reflects bad on the organisation.

  As with all JCs it would seem that, if the "sin" is established, then convincing them you are repentant is the only way to avoid disfellowshipping.

  If it's not certain whether they have proof, then challenging the evidence may be problematic when it later comes to claiming repentance, so need to be careful how to play it.
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  blondie

  I have only seen jws df'd when they had an accident that made the papers and it was stated they were over the limit, or their name was printed from the government list of people arrested for DUI. Publicity about their drinking got them df'd.
• 

  problemaddict

  Hey RO,

  Ok so interestingly enough I had a friend of mine removed from a position of service over this very issue. I followed it as closely as I could and there are a few things you should know. Your friend most of all however, has to get over his nerves, and not be afraid to ask them questions, and WRITE DOWN the answers. Make sure he asks very directly if this is an investigative comitee, or a judicial hearing.

  Here are some key questions;

  1) Brothers, you mentioned multiple warnings regarding alcohol, can you please tell me when these occured? (Write down the answers. Get DATES)

  2) Brothers who has accused me of being drunk and what is it this person said they saw? (write it down....do not show annoyance but rather concern) You have the right to know the NAMES of your accusers. There must be more than one, and they have to be names. You also have the right to confront them and bring them into a meeting if it progresses. Do not let this one go. People back off when called out to this extent.

  3) Brothers is a there a reason you did not tell sister _______ to apply mathew 18 if she was stumbled by something that I did? (let them explain why it doesn't apply, and be sure to then look it up and read it to show it DOES apply)

  4) I really need to speak with my accusers to be able to win back my brothers, before I go any further with you guys. I believe there has been a misunderstanding.

  Something like that. Don't shy away from your rights.