LongHairGal - "I am not on any mission to drag anybody out of the kingdom hall and don't feel it is my job to do so."
Ditto; why feed the "apostate" stereotype, after all?
Reverse-Witnessing leaves me mentally and emotionally drained...
by ILoveTTATT 28 Replies latest jw friends
-
Vidiot
-
Oubliette
It is exhausting. But I have a question for you: With all the much more obvious and bigger issues which clearly prove the WT leadership are full of sh*t, why would you even engage on an obscure subject such as the "ban on vaccinations"?
BTW, let's get one thing straight, when the WT makes a "suggestion" we all know that all "good, obedient JWs" know they should follow it as if it were a rule. It's one way to separate the "spiritually strong" ones from the "weak." [Wink, wink.]
Once you recognize this as the manipulative technique it is, it loses its mysterious hold. But since most JWs still under-the-spell of WT mind-control do NOT recognize it as such, they can respond with such mind-numbing denials as "the WT never said that ...".
It's bullsh*t. Personally, I refuse to discuss silly topics that become word games.
Just ask them this: If the "New Light" about the current GB, and the GB alone, being the FDS is true, then doesn't that mean that the GB has been wrong about its own prophetic identity for the last 93 years?
Refuse to accept any evasions, non-answers, equivocation or any other such rhetorical nonsense. There are only two accurate, honest answers to this question and they are:
- "Yes, they were wrong in the past, but they are right now" or
- "No they were right in the past and they are wrong now"
Either way they've screwed themselves out of any possible credibility. If the GB has been in the past or is now wrong about something as significant as their own prophetic identity, how can we be sure they are right about anything? And I mean anything and everything!
We can't.
It's simply stupid to give blind obedience to a group of guys that can't even figure out what a common word like "generation" means.
End of discussion.
Let's go grab dinner!
-
Aunt Fancy
When my hubby and I first found out about TTATT we felt the same way you did, and we wanted to help others out. We were able to help a few but we soon realized that we wanted to live our life and do other things with it. I remember we were thinking of everyone we could help out and it became an obsession with us but I think you will soon realize there is very little you can do for most of them and just be there for those coming out who may need some help. Continue to try to help those you think are on the edge but be careful because you could end up branded as an apostate when you aren't ready for that step. There are ways to help those who have left because they are still haunted by the lies and some have never researched even though they have left. This is an area we have been able to help some in. We are trying to be balanced and hopefully you will soon get this in balance. It is a good quality to help others out and you are very young so go out and enjoy your life and make new friends and maybe find a charity that you are interested in and help others. You will also find that it is a roller coaster ride. When we first left my emotions were all over the place and now after a year they are settling down some and there aren't nearly as many bad days. We are always here for you.
-
ILoveTTATT
Thank you all for your very kind and good words. As always, your posts leave me with lots to think about. I will try and write back as soon as possible.
ILTTATT
-
problemaddict
ILTTY, Hey I think you kind of answered your thoughts right out of the gate. Your dad, and a friend, are awake now. So just think about that when you think about the hard work. Come here, JW facts, and other places where most of your friends have done the heavy lifting. Don't give up on the people you care about. No good is done if we all remain silent, but everyone has to do it in their own way. As for this paragraph.... Most certainly it cannot reasonably or Scripturaly be argued and proved that, by being vaccinated, the inoculated person is either eating or drinking blood and consuming it as food or receiving a blood transfusion. Vaccination does not bear any relationship to or any likeness to the intermarriage of angelic "sons of God" with the daughters of men, as described in Genesis 6:1-4. Neither can it be put in the same class as described at Leviticus 18:23-24, which forbids the mingling of humans with animals. I think it pretty much sums it up. Vaccinations were only banned in as much as fractions of blood were understood to be blood. This paragraph is an interesting admission that inoculations (with the fractioned blood), is not in and of itself eating anything. I had never seen this before and related it to that. Vaccinations, are really just a springboard to blood as a whole which at this point is indefensible. Organs were flat banned, and then allowed. I was a JW apologist for a while. Now I'm a JW APOLOGY maker......if you get my drift.
-
Vanderhoven7
If you want energy...talk to TruJW
-
DesirousOfChange
You cannot wake up a JW. Something has to happen to them to make them see that something is wrong with the religion. It is different for everybody.
Sad but (usually) true.
But you can plant the seeds that will grow when they (the person) is ready to let them grow.
Doc
-
nonjwspouse
Sadly, as DOC has stated. I have had t learn the hard way that there is no magic or single way to make people "see". In fact, we cannot do that ourselves. It is the individual and their readiness to question that is the only key. If they are not ready to question, there is nothing we can say or do besides plant the subtle seeds that will someday, hopefully grow into a desire to learn more about the real TTAT.
From what I have read and seen, a faithful JW will obey, period. Regardless of what is said or shown to them etc. They shut down to anything but the current WT indoctrination, period, end of subject. To try to reach those is like hitting your head against a brick wall, which is have had experience doing. It hurts, a lot. So slow, continual, planting of subtle seeds is the best we can do until and if a person is really ready for TTAT.
I have to keep re-reading Hassans materials, coming here, etc to remind myself not to confront, regardless of the glassy eyed indoctrination regurgitation that is said to me.
I am learning and planting those subtle seeds, trying to figure out more and more how to relate other things that if he internally compared his true belief with the WT, it would be in opposition of the WT stance. If the WT subject does come up I try to keep my statements to a very brief but powerful one and then leave the room. No arguing. Arguing causes him to shut down, but alone time is not confronting, so who knows.
I completely get the emotionally and mentally, and even physical drainng this causes. I allowed myself to become physically sick over this a year ago. ( along with other big stresses, but this one is the one that caused me to really sink)
I hope you find your own balance soon. It is important for you to remain healthy in all respects so you can most effectivly live your life.
-
ABibleStudent
Hi ILoveTTATT, When you feel stressed out about reverse witnessing, take a break and have some fun. Reverse witnessing is stressful and energy draining, so make a plan to have fun and reverse witness when you feel happy and energized.
If JWs say something that you feel that they cannot prove, ask them how they would feel if they asked you a question that you would not provide them an answer to justify your opinion. If your goal is to help JWs to critically think for themselves, then it is a good thing to help them recognize that circular reasoning should be avoided instead of constantly used to justify WTBTS doctrines to their cult persona and non-JWs.
If you can find someway to help a JW's authentic persona to feel embarrassment about using circular reasoning, you will gain an ally and increase a JW's cognitive dissonance while reducing your frustration. I like the quote that is attributed to Abraham Lincoln: " Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt." Or, you could quote Proverbs 17:28 " Even fools are thought wise if they keep silent, and discerning if they hold their tongues." How would JWs respond if you started quoting them those sayings everytime they said something that they could not prove.
Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,
Robert