by ILoveTTATT 24 Replies latest jw friends
Crazyguy: You have a PM.
ILoveTTATT: "half-truths and they utilize SOME truths"--this reminds me of my own journey. I started out assuming there were some truths: I didn't trust JWFacts. Randy Watters of Freeminds scared me for some reason. The more I sifted and researched, the more I realize that they were telling the truth 100% and it was the Watchtower that was practicing deception.
Since JWfacts is the top critical site of the JWs when JW leaders slander their critics by saying
they all tell lies . They must be referring to JWfacts.
But NEVER have they pointed out what these supposed lies are .
Not even one .
So the natural question also is .
Who's really lying?
I would like to comment, for lurkers, that the best advice one can give you, the best advice of all JWN, is
Of course, like Phizzy said, some people go way too far, and need to do some better research. However, www.jwfacts.com is a very well-researched site. It actually goes and gives you the necessary references to the Watchtower publications that say what is being said on the website.
My journey is very similar to Londo's... I really started out thinking that apostates were a bunch of liars. Then I found out that the WT society carries on a humoungous lie...
It makes it really hard to know the truth (about the JW's) if the liars (the JW's) are calling themselves "the truth" and that same liar calls the ones who say the truth (apostates) liars...
And when we (apostates) try to tell your families, your wives, your children, your husbands, mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, etc... that you are in a SCAM and you need to GET OUT... we are called names, insulted, shunned, etc.
Do you now see how FRUSTRATING it is?? But we must keep on... telling the TRUTH about "the truth"...
We welcome you all... and please, open your eyes!!
ILoveTTATT
This is a great thread and it's a great post IloveTTAT. There as so many good replies (comments) here, too. You know, when I first started to investigate TTAT, I just wanted to know "the Truth". I wasn't interested in anyone's opinion. I wanted to formulate my own opinion and draw any conclusions based on "the facts". Of course, this lead to a lot of reading. I liked sites like JWFACTS, because it "proved" what the WTS said in the past - most of their errors are in print and others are found on "taped talks".
I was soon concluding that JWs are no different than any other religion that says it has the truth. Of course, that's not exactly true. And, here's what I mean. JWs are adament that THEY alone have "the Truth" and they shun anyone who leaves their religion. This lead me to conclude that they are a cult. But, that's not where it ends. I've concluded that this religion (The Jehovah's Witnesses, the WTS, and whatever other name is used to identify them) are a sham! That's right, they are a hoax - a so-called religion that "claims" to be the only truth, the only organization backed by God, etc. The facts (including their blemished history and record of changed doctrines) prove they are a fraud. And, I mainly aim that comment at the leaders of the WTS/Jehovah's Witnesses. The leaders are total frauds and they know it!
This is my conclusion based on years of reading "the facts" - so much of these facts are documented on the internet and easily proven by going to the source WTS literature. It's too bad that so many of us were fooled and taken advantage of. Most of us exJWs are really GOOD people and do good in their life! Thanks again to everyone for your fine input.
Its not about truth for the NY gang. Its about control. Authority. Even if you would hold all the teachings they do and just found a JWbis org. You would still be an apostate to them. truth does not matter.
A whole book would have to be written about all the doctrinal changes.
really.... hmmmmm..... a book that just details what JW's believe now and how those beliefs evolved and why. hmmmm.... interesting.... has this been done? or is this a new idea for a motivated ex-JW journalist out there?
I have to say, that I love your posts ILoveTTAT! I'm going to repeat what you said:
"It makes it really hard to know the truth (about the JW's) if the liars (the JW's) are calling themselves "the truth" and that same liar calls the ones who say the truth (apostates) liars...
And when we (apostates) try to tell your families, your wives, your children, your husbands, mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, etc... that you are in a SCAM and you need to GET OUT... we are called names, insulted, shunned, etc.
Do you now see how FRUSTRATING it is?? But we must keep on... telling the TRUTH about "the truth"..."
Here's why I'm repeating this. Most (if not all) exJWs used to blindly buy-in to what the WTS told us about ex-members (aka Apostates). Of course, all of us would have to admit that we NEVER gave the exJWs a chance to explain themselves. We were simply told to avoid them and above all, "To not listen to them."
It takes a determined individual to not allow themselves to be bullied by the leaders of the WTS. It also takes a "humble" JW to want to investigate what ex-members are saying. After all, if what ex-JWs are saying is true, the only conclusion is that the religion of JWs is a hoax and to admit that after years (decades) of membership requires humility!!! Unfortunately, some JWs will NEVER embark on learning TTATT (The Truth About The Truth) because they "can't handle the truth"!
All I know is this. If the WTS really was "the Truth", nothing could be shown to members that would convince them otherwise, unless of course, if the Truth is NOT "the Truth"! And, that's why the acronym TTATT has so much meaning. Once you investigate and study things outside the walls of the Kingdom Hall/WTS, you see/understand things that you didn't see/understand before. You also see how the WTS leaders/writers employ "logical fallacies" to cover-up their mistakes/errors/etc. in order to "play" with your mind.
I'll tell you... all of this research (including how the WTS uses Logical Fallacies) really awakens you and allows you to see not only the JW religion without blinders, it educates you in an overall manner not to ever be fooled by anyone (or any organization) again who employs mind-control techiques to convince you of their propaganda.
Knowledge is INEED power and a protection! Thankfully, the internet has opened up a door for all JWs to learn TTATT.
Truth stands up to scrutiny, lies do not.
Well said LisaRose
and yes the WTS. has been a great marketing scam within the realm of religious publishing .
Charlatanism at its definitive finest.
I also want to state, whether the WTS leaders are guilty of "group-think" or outright fraud, I'll let others decide for themselves. However, for me if something isn't the truth YET claims to be, that is fraud - simple as that. It does bother me that there are no modern-day Ray Franz's amongs that group. I mean, isn't there at least one of those leaders whose conscience is stricken by TTATT?
I have this conspiracy theory that the new members of the GB, before they become such , are thoroughly tested as to their total allegience to the Organization, even if the Organization is wrong about something. (Or even most things).
Whether such a person has a knowledge that it is not the "Truth" or not, is not relevant, what is, is that the new prospective GB member will NEVER let the existing incumbents down, even if they go as far as the Nazis.
So, we need never expect a Ray Franz again.
As to the JWFacts.com web site, the most telling thing about it, for JW's is that, if you can show that something on there is wrong, factually, doctrinally, or whatever, Paul promises to change it.
I really must e-mail the wonderful chap and ask him if he has ever had to change anything of substance, I very much doubt it.
How different form the WT attitude, " Accept what we say now, or else !!, even if we know it is false."
