The true meaning on how light and darkness/day and night are created BEFORE the sun and moon....

by EndofMysteries 15 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  EndofMysteries

  I could get real deep into this topic because every phase of the creation days go much further than how they appear when read in a literal sense.

  I am only going to stick to the question and explanation in the title of the thread. Many say the bible and creation days make no sense at all, how is day and night, and morning/evening, all done before the sun and moon which we use for day and night and morning and evening created? It seems out of order, hence it must be false.

  It's easier to understand it if you read them through an interlinear bible, because translaters not understanding the true message ends up omitting important parts in the translation. But I'll explain it from reading any bible.

  Genesis is not just describing how Earth was created. Genesis is using physical/earthly terms to describe deeper knowledge as well, including light and darkness. Light and darkness in the spirtual and symbolic sense as well.

  In Genesis 1:2-5 is describing the creation and seperation of light and darkness, day and night. Good and evil? maybe. In vs 6 through 8, there is a further division of the light and darkness and an expanse separating them, this expanse he calls heaven. So there are waters on the OTHER side of heaven. (what exactly does this heaven / expanse include?)

  In vs 14 God creates luminaires to go in this expanse, which included the sun and the moon. He says they are created "To make a division between the day and the night" AND to serve as signs and for seasons and days and years.

  In vs 16, the greater luminary will DOMINATE the day, and the lesser luminary will dominate the night.

  So as you can see, you've had it mixed around. The light and the darkness was first, and the light dominates the day, and the sun was made to show us when the light was dominating, and the darkness/moon for when the darkness dominates, also for signs and for knowing times.

  Another very interesting thing, I forgot if it is the book of Enoch or the secrets of Enoch, but if you compare the creation days with this understanding, you'll see they match up as well.
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  confusedandalone

  so it appears god didn't care enough to just make it easy to understand something that should have been a simple explanation. What a dick
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  EndofMysteries

  I made reply in another thread about God's creation of vegatation and animals in Genesis, so I thought I'd post that reply here as well....

  In hebrew interlinear it's explained well, whereas in english translations it's lost.

  Let's start with vegetation in Genesis 1:11 and 12. From hebrew interlinear the true message will say something like this...."and elohim says, "The Earth, let her produce seed for grass, fruit trees, and all sorts of vegetation, AND HE IS BECOMING SO, and the earth brings forth seed for all vegatation".

  When Moses asked God what his name was, in hebrew interlinear he says, "I shall become what I shall become". Notice how after he said that Earth would produce SEED for all vegetation, it then says, AND HE IS BECOMING SO. God become/put his lifeforce into the seed, so that after that point, once he would start watering it and create the sun/light, it would grow.

  Genesis doesn't say the vegetation grew BEFORE the sun, it only says the SEED was made.

  The same concept happened when the creation of animals and such, and even man. They would be like a dead body and then his life force would enter them and they would come to life. "He would become".
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  EndofMysteries

  confusedandalone - when you read and understand it through the interlinear, it is pretty simple. Blame the translators.
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  confusedandalone

  or...or...or.... Its just an explanation of people who have no idea what the hell really happened so they came up with a good story that impressed the other sheep herders of the time. I find the explanations of creation from other cultures far more entertaining.
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  EndofMysteries

  confusedandalone - perhaps, but the bottom line is the creation account as written without translation error is NOT out of order and it does make sense. Anybody can have their multitude of reasons to still not believe, but it shouldn't be based on thinking the bible says that grass and trees grew prior to the sun being created, or that daytime and daylight and nightlight on the earth were here before the sun and moon were made when that isn't what it was saying.
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  adamah

  Actually, the creation narrative was done for a VERY GOOD REASON: for THEOLOGICAL purposes, i.e. to establish dominance over other competing deities and beliefs in the Ancient Near East, based on an older Babylonian account. Remember, the Sun and Moon were worshipped as deities by those in Egypt (eg Sun Ra), so saying that Jehovah created them was a frontal attack on other pagan beliefs.

  From: http://www.religioustolerance.org/com_geba.htm

  The Babylonian creation story is called by its first two words "Enuma Elish." According to archaeologists, it was originally written circa 1120 BCE. It was discovered in 1875 CE. It bears many points of similarity to the first creation story in the Bible: 1

  Item	Ancient Israelite Creation Story	Babylonian Creation Story
  Source	Genesis 1:1 to 2:3	Enuma Elish
  Date of writing (liberal belief)	8th or 9th century BCE	Late 12th century BCE
  Date of writing (conservative belief)	13th century BCE, the time of Moses	Late 12th century BCE.
  Author (liberal belief)	"P," authors of the Priestly tradition.	Unknown.
  Author (conservative belief)	Moses.	Unknown.
  Creator(s) of the universe	A single God, YHVH.	A God battling a Goddess.
  Initial state of the earth	Desolate waste; covered in darkness.	Chaos; enveloped in darkness.
  First development	Light created.	Light created.
  Next development	Firmament created - a rigid dome over the earth separating the earth and heaven.	Firmament created; also perceived as a rigid dome.
  Next development	Dry land created.	Dry land created.
  Next development	Sun, moon, stars created.	Sun, moon, stars created.
  Next development	Creation of men and women.	Creation of men and women.
  Final development	God rests and sanctify the Sabbath.	Gods rest and celebrate.

  The order wasn't done for scientific purposes, but THEOLOGICAL reasons. It reflects the scientific ignorance of the ancient author (Priestly source), since he wasn't even remotely aware of photosynthesis (needed for plants to grow).

  Adam
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  EndofMysteries

  adamah - I looked it up a bit and they are close to identical. The israelite story also has the male and female. http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Enuma_Elish.html for example in a hebrew interlinear, the earth is female as well and the sky is male. Even in nature that makes sense, it's a little gross to think of it but I believe some civilizations believed that earth / dirt was female and sky was male and rain was like semen. the rain penetrates the seed in the female ground and the seed grows.

  also in the bible, does it not say, 'let US create man'? Also in the NT, Jesus is said to have been with God 'in the beginning'.

  It's interesting you pointed that out, but even more interesting that the hebrew scriptures still have a male/female part.

  In Jeremiah the Israelites are said to be worshipping the "queen of the heavens". Wisdom is given a 'female' attribute in the scriptures and is said to have been God's masterworker I think?

  Even if the babylon writings are older, it wouldn't make it wrong if there was any truth to them whether from the israel or babylonian side of it.
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  EndofMysteries

  adamah - another thing, I know the JW's always put babylon as being pure evil and the bad guys, but repeatedly in the bible, it shows God used Babylon and many times the kings of babylon had much respect for the God of Israel. If all of that is true, then there is a chance the babylon teachings of the creation were adopted or learned from the israelites. It could go either way, but since there are many things in the old testament hinting towards more to the story then is widely understood, and that the hebrew old testament also has the male and female attributes, that it might be a close copy of what Israel believed and why is says "us" in genesis for the creation.
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  DS211

  End of ministries what interlinesr are you using