Is asking questions of logic about a Global Flood effective in waking loved ones?

by BU2B 32 Replies latest jw friends

  • BU2B
    BU2B

    I was thinking about using a tactic of asking questions revolving around "Noahs Flood" to try to start my wife doing some serious thinking. Unlike doctrine that cannot often be PROVEN one way or another, this issue CAN be PROVEN beyond the slightest doubt that it is impossible.

    I was thinking about asking a question something like this "I was reading about coral reefs today, and they sure are amazing! What amazed me the most is how long it takes for them to build the reef, and how long they live! The Great Barrier Reef they say is 6000-8000 years old! It is also interesting how delicate they are. A temperature or salt level change can wipe out a whole colony, and they only survive in a certain depth of water. I wonder how they survived the flood, when they had many miles of water over them.. How do you think they survived?

    I dont know if this will work, I was thinking about asking something about how 8 people multiplied enough in 99 years to build cities costruct the tower of babel, all while spreading to China, the Americas, and Egypt all at the same time. The Insight book says that there may have been 4,000 males alive 100 years after the flood. How could they build all of that when 2 Chronicles says that it took 70000 laboreres, 80000 stonecutters, and thousands more just to build the temple, yet 4000 could build the tower of Babel, not to mention the pyramids etc.

    I think getting someone to see the Flood is not literal is so key, because it may get someone to think, "If this is wrong, what else is?" Also it is indefensible. The trick is broaching it gently.

    No wonder the WT discourages higher education. No truly educated person could believe in a global flood being possible.

    Please share your thoughts, and if anone has any good ideas for questions regarding this topic, please do share.

    -Brought Up 2 Believe

  • sspo
    sspo

    No truly educated person will believe that mankind has been around for only 6000 years.

    Most witnesses will discard any evidence that contradicts what the GB says. They feel they are being used by Jehovah and will throw away evidence and bury their doubts.

    It's worth giving a try with your wife, put some doubts in her mind and see where it goes. Good luck to you.

  • Comatose
    Comatose

    Also, toss in the fact that Noah and sons heard gods voice. Saw his miracle, spoke with him, and lived for most of the 99 years following the flood. But, somehow did such a POOR job with their kids their were enough people to make the tower of babel? How can that be?

  • bohm
    bohm

    it might work, but be very aware of how she react and be prepared to drop the subject. Is she otherwise interested in science?

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    It is worth a try, but it depends on the person. Some philosophers say that you cannot reason someone out of a belief that they did not reach by reason. But JW's think they reached their beliefs by reason, so it is worth the try.

  • adamah
    adamah

    BU2B, quibbling over the scientific impossibilities of the Flood is generally time-wasted, IMO, since your protests are easily-dismissed as 'miracles', the "get out of jail free" card played by theists whenever they can reasonably be employed (and in this case, they can: the whole Flood account is obviously based on Divine intervention, which allows rampant incitement of miracles).

    Instead, it's better to focus on the morality of God wiping out humanity (AND plants AND animals) with no opportunity for salvation, after God decides He made a boo-boo by making mankind and there was something He forgot to do BEFORE the Flood (prohibiting bloodshed: oops....).

    Also, since the flood account is used as the prototype of Armageddon by Xians, later Xian theology required Noah to be rewritten as a preacher of salvation (per 2nd Peter), rather than what Judaism's reading of Genesis says: Noah preached condemnation, with no room on board the ark for survivors. God's solution didn't allow for survivors, but handing down a law against bloodshed and appointing Noah to establish the first system of criminal justice in the World, in essence placing his fellow man under his dominion (just like God had ordered Adam to place the animals under dominion).

    http://awgue.weebly.com/genesis-vs-2nd-peter-noah-didnt-preach-bupkis.html

    It's also good to ask a JW if God will regret Armageddon after He carries it out, like Genesis says how God regretted carrying out the Flood (God also admitted that He regretted making mankind BEFORE the Flood: does God make many mistakes which He later regrets)?

    Review the original message of Noah's flood found in Genesis, since JW's misunderstanding of the moral of the story directly leads to their flawed blood doctrine:

    awgue.weebly.com/does-jehovahs-witnesses-blood-policy-reflect-they-understand-noahs-flood.html

    Adam

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    JW: It was a miracle. All things are possible with God.

  • tornapart
    tornapart

    It doesn't wake them up but I have used some things with family. The bible doesn't say the flood was global. I've made the point that it couldn't have been global because how would all of Austrailia's indigenous mammals ALL be marsupials. Why are lemurs only found in the wild on Madagascar? If the flood was global these animals would have been everywhere. It makes them think but I haven't found it changes anything.

  • bohm
  • Billy the Ex-Bethelite
    Billy the Ex-Bethelite

    Talking about the flood was a subject I've used many times. The most memorable was with my parents. It didn't "wake them up", but it changed their point of view and they haven't hassled me about fading.

    Two things worth mentioning: 1) I didn't pose it as my question... something that I thought up. Instead I worded the entire subject as something I'd encountered in "the ministry", and a fair question that anybody could ask at the door. If somebody at the door asks a logical question of you at the door, you can't scream "That's apostate!" It's a reasonable Bible question that deserves an answer. Which leads to... 2) I phrased the question in such a way that WT should supply an answer. When discussing it with my parents and they tried to make up an explanation, I stopped them and said it wasn't their place to come up with an explanation outside of WT publications. If WT produces a Reasoning book, it should answer such a basic question.

    More details about the way I raised questions.

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/254990/1/exJW-Psychology-102-How-to-Ask-a-Question-When-Questions-Arent-Allowed#.UqEs2-Iljcw

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