Ever consider joining The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

by rawe 139 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Qcmbr

  You really think your evidence against is better than my evidencefor

  Yes - that's why I was forced to confront reality despite wanting it all to be true. You don't know what your line is the sand is. With Joseph and the church you have no criteria for determining what is true or false. Right now you would struggle to articulate what would be too far, too ridiculous, too far fetched in the history of JS. This is where I was.

  Please feel free to compare the list of Book of Mormon animals

  Asses
  Cattle
  Cows
  Cummoms
  Cureloms
  Elephants
  Fish
  Game
  Goat
  Horses
  Oxen
  Serpents
  Sheep
  Swine
  Vultures

  with the indigenous animals of North and South America and see how many hits you get and ask yourself why Joseph didn't include any easy hits.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_South_American_mammals

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mammals_of_North_America
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  Qcmbr

  While you are at it have a look at what your best evidence for the Book of Mormon is - the killer argument. I suggest you'll choose between chiastic forms or NHM/NHR. We have more evidence for a tiny Viking settlement in Americas than for the huge Jaredite , Nephite and Lamanite civilisations. hmm.
• 

  RubaDub

  Yes, I seriously thought about becoming a Mormon or an Hasidic Jew.

  However, with the Mormons the Majic Underwear gave me a rash. Then I tried to be an Hasidic Jew but couldn't get a black hat that fit my head properly.

  I decided to stay in my comfort zone as a JW.

  Rub a Dub
• 

  Cold Steel

  Pre-Columbian Wheels
  Just a few years ago, no one thought the Mayans had wheels, yet toys have now been found with wheels. The Book of Mormon also mentions level roads, and in Mesoamerica are the only level roads ever discovered. Most use the Roman design, which has a higher top so water runoff would occur; however, the Mayans didn't need or use such roads. And why would they have such large roads if there were no wheels? But back in the 60s, archeologists found four massive wheels of stone with square peg holes cut in the middle. They were enormous. Besides, how did they get the stones from the quarries if they didn't have conveyances of some sort? And what pulled them?

  Anachronisms: Our scholars have made a list and have been checking it twice. So why do the list of anachronisms continue to plummet like a rock? In 1842, our list had only eight confirmed; in 2005, it has dropped to 36 confirmed. If the Book of Mormon was false, it should be going the other direction. When the Book of Mormon first appeared, do any of you guys know how many gold or other metal plates had ever been discovered with writing on them? Close your eyes...whaddya see? That's right, nothing! No gold plates in stone boxes in ancient America or ancient Old World. Now they've been found all over the place.

  

  

  Chariots

  Proof of wheels didn't exist until fairly recently.

  Book of Mormon Animals

  Deutero-Isaiah and the Book of Mormon
  Isaiah in the Book of Mormon

  .

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=qkydMSmv1Zo
• 

  cofty

  Mormon "scholars" are wasting their time polishing a turd.

  I have read large parts of the book. It's childish nonsense.

  When Joe Smith wrote down the parts he clearly plagiarized from the King James bible why did he not have the wit to update the language?

  exmormon.org...
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  2+2=5

  Were you once a JW Cold Steel? Why the fascination with this site? Are you here to convert us?
• 

  designs

  "We might put in that instead of the New Testament producing the Church, the Church produced the New Testament" scholar A. Powell Davies

  The same can be said for such works as the Book of Mormon. Clever, dupes a lot of readers, but on careful examination the BOM falls hard just like the NT.
• 

  rawe

  Hi 2+2=5,

  "Were you once a JW Cold Steel? Why the fascination with this site? Are you here to convert us?"

  Cold Steel answered that near the top of this thread. His interest in Jehovah's Witnesses stems from some family members that left the LDS faith to become Jehovah's Witnesses.

  Cheers,

  -Randy
• 

  rawe

  Hi Designs,

  "Clever, dupes a lot of readers, but on careful examination the BOM falls hard just like the NT."

  There are some important differences though. The NT is a collection of books by different authors written in ancient Greek. We have on hand bona fide copies of early manuscripts, such as the one I saw (P45) at Chester Beaty Library in Dublin. In contrast not a single shred of physical evidence places the Book of Mormon in a period prior to the 1830s or in a language other than English (16th century English at that). You'll notice arguments always tend to focus on unique theories regarding the setting of the Book of Mormon (a bit in Jerusalem area then a move to the Americas). No one points to originals of the gold plates for inspection and non-biased translation. It is also true the NT quotes the OT (usually a the Septuagint -- a Greeek translation of the OT). However, nowhere would you find several consecutive chapters of the OT copied verbatim into the NT -- let alone the source of the copying being the KJV of 1611!

  It should be noted, that even if the Book of Mormon had an accurate setting, that in itself would not lift up beyond fiction. Works of fiction often have relatively believable settings.

  Cheers,

  -Randy
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  TD

  Do you really believe these books are where Joseph Smith got his writing style from?

  --Can't speak for Qcmbcr, but it's pretty obvious that the BOM contains many linguistic similarities to the AV, which is an observation that LDS apologists have no problem agreeing with especially when it comes to the Isaiah parallels of Second Nephi.

  But this again begs the question of why a poorly translated Greek idiom unique to only one writer of the NT is sprinkled thoughout the books of Nephi.