The Christian Hope--Is it in Heaven or on Earth?

by DS211 39 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  The Searcher

  CRAZYGUY said - "You make a good point Perry, but why then does Paul talk so much about a heavenly calling?"

  I puzzled over Paul's wording, so I looked at the the original Greek to see if maybe something had been lost in translation and his actual context had been skewed. Here it it is:

  (Hebrews 3:1) Consequently, holy brothers, partakers of the heavenly calling (invitation - footnote in NWT)

  • heavenly - epouranios (adj) - of heavenly origin or nature. (The ORIGIN of the invitation)

  (Philippians 3:14) I am pursuing down toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus.

  upward - anō - up, upwards, above, on high

  call - klēsis - a calling, calling to, a call, invitation, to a feast, of the divine invitation to embrace salvation of God.

  Was Paul simply reminding Christians of the the sourceof the invitation to all men to gain salvation through Christ, (heaven) rather than claiming it was the destination?

  If heaven is the destination, then the promises at Psalm 37:9-11, 29 ("And they will reside forever upon it") Revelation 21:3,4 (Tent of God is with mankind, who will have no more pain, death etc.) and other descriptive verses, become very confusing and create problems as to what is actually being promised!
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  DS211

  Eden can you elaborate on why its heaven? Because many here are saying earth or both
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  THE GLADIATOR

  Re: The Christian Hope--Is it in Heaven or on Earth?

  Personally, I think it is in the mind of the believer - that is why it's called belief.
• 

  Bobcat

  I was wondering if a list of verses that might give the idea of a heavenly destiny could be compiled on this thread so as to get a fuller picture of where things stand.

  As Searcher pointed out, some of the verses could be taken in two ways. For example, Hebrews 3:1 refers to the "heavenly calling." This could be taken as a call for the disciple to 'go to heaven' or as a call 'originating from' heaven. Similarly, some might take Jesus' words to 'store up treasures in heaven' as meaning that they will end up there. Others could just as well take those words as having a meaning something like, 'placing your hope in God as oposed to worldly hopes,' with no reference to where the disciple would eventually end up.

  A complete list of all such verses would allow one to seperate which ones could be taken either way and which ones would necessarily require a heavenly or earthly destiny. And then the contexts could be analyzed.

  Take Care
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  kneehighmiah

  Based on Revelation 7, Matthew 24 and 1 Thes 4, it seems that Christ's followers who survive the tribulation will be taken to heaven. Then at armageddon as mentioned in Revelation 19, God destroys his enemies (the kings of the earth and those who persecuted his followers). Following Armageddon the nations still exist as mentioned in Revelation chapter 20. Christ's followers who were taken to heaven judge the nations for 1000 years. Following the 1000 years and the destruction of Satan and all evildoers, in chapter 21 we see a new heaven and a new earth and new Jerusalem coming down out of heaven. Then all the nations recieve God's blessings Rev 21:3,4.

  Based on what I've read in the Bible there is only one hope for Christians, the heavenly one. The earthly hope is for the meek of the nations who turn to God during the 1000 years and pass the final test.

  It would make no sense to make Christians prove faithful through the great tribulation and then have to pass the final test as well. That's double jeopardy. Once you pass the great tribulation you inherit life, the first resurrection. In a similar vein, the final test is for those of the nations to prove that they are faithful to God.
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  DS211

  kneehigh--that makes sense in context of the bible...

  always thought the second test stuff was ridiculous....for le it makes those who follow God follow him "or else", thereby negating the love they have for him "whole heartedly"....
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  jeremiah18:5-10

  IMHO, there is no answer to this question. If asking what is taught in the Christian Greek scriptures, I feel unreservedly only "heaven" is offered as a final destination or hope. But what I always come back to is, what is heaven? We know what earth is, we can totally imagine a better life on earth. Heaven though is entirely in the imagination of the beholder. Nobody can testify to going to heaven, nobody can describe it, nobody can tell you what the bible writer meant when referring to heaven. Most commonly heaven is referred to as a concept of perfection, a world without problems as we know them. This is the only thing attractive about such an idea, along with getting to receive answers or understanding of matters commonly postulated on like who is god, how did we get here, what is the purpose of life. I find no satisfying answer to what destination if any awaits Christians or non Christians. It takes an incredible leap of unfounded faith to believe in going to heaven because it can't be based on any known, established facts or testimony.
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  THE GLADIATOR

  I do believe we are singing from the same hymn-sheet.
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  EdenOne

  DS211,

  Phillipians 3:12-15 - "pressing on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God by means of Christ Jesus. Therefore, let those of us who are mature be of this mental attitude, and if you are mentally inclined otherwise in any respect, God will reveal the above attitude to you."

  Ephesians 4:4, 5 - "There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism"

  Colossians 3:2 - "Keep your minds fixed on the things above, not on the things on the earth."

  Matthew 5:3-12 - "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven... Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called children of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven... Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

  John 14:2 - "There is more than enough room in my Father's home. If this were not so, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?"

  Colossians 1:4, 5 - " We heard of your faith in Christ Jesus and the love you have for all the holy ones because of the hope that is being reserved for you in the heavens”

  Revelation 19:1 - "After this I heard what sounded like the roar of a great multitude in heaven shouting: "Hallelujah! Salvation and glory and power belong to our God"

  There are many more, but these may give you something to ponder about. You can read this article where this subject is considered in-depht.

  Eden
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  humbled

  Jeremiah 18:5-10,

  I like what you said: the question can't be answered.

  Everyone's earnest thought and study figuring out the hereafter doesn't add up to anything conclusive--It only seems relevant to live honestly and treat others well. If there is a life after, trust that a perfect court will find you not guilty.