Did Satan prove God wrong? a possible bibical flaw (page 2)

MikeMusto

the reason we have the debate is cuz of the internet

plmkrzy

God like the MarineCorps is Only looking for a FEW GOOD MEN.

Love is one of life's mysteries, like lightning, it never strikes. For others, like lightning, it strikes several times. So wear a rubber crash helmet

LucidSky

If I still believed, I would prefer the answers the Bible Students had:

The trials we face and that the angels observe are not to test us, but to perfect us. Without evil how can one ever know the meaning of empathy, compassion, and real love? This "present world" is for the selection of the "Church" (i.e. Christ's Body) -- which includes all genuine Christians. The rest of humanity will be elevated as humans in the "world to come".

Liberty

Hi Leander,

Satan, the very few times he actually appears in the Bible, always seemed like the voice of reason to me compared to the psychopathic behaviour of God. These Biblical fables could be seen as subtle jabs at authority by their originators calling into question the legitimacy of self proclaimed authorities/rulers and why we subject ourselves to them. The priests and scribes who most likely wrote the final forms of these oral myths had personal agendas just like writers today. I'm sure some of them were fed up with their leaders and they quietly put these rebellious tendancies into these Bible stories using the Devil to make their points for them, leaving them an out if they got caught because they could always claim that they were just illustrating how bad the Devil is. Deniability was important to these clever fellows because their brutal murderous leaders would have any opposition folks punished with a long and painful death. Luckily, most brutal leaders are not very literate so most of them never noticed the questioning attitude in these stories against the brutish God which gave them their illusionary legitimacy to bully the rest of the population.

So yes, I think the Devil in these stories is often right. Ask yourself, why do Christians serve God? For the prizes baby! and to avoid the punishments! Why else would there be promises of everlasting perfect lives in paradise or eternal torment? If it weren't for the prizes or punishments religions wouldn't have any followers. If God said, "worship me and you'll get exactly the same thing that you would get anyway if you didn't" how many Christians would there be? This is also why the Free Will concept among Christians is such a crock. How can you freely make a choice if you are punished or rewarded when you choose? We cow-tow to God just like we do to brutal dictators in this world because of fear and/or the hope of rewards. The Bible writers lived under brutal murderous dictators, whether their own or under a conquering army, so they were very famiiar with these choices and the spirit realm reflected this reality from their own lives. Hence Ol'Jehover is the stupid brute killer God always throwing a tantrum and whining that no one accepts His legitimate authority. Would a Super Being creator of the Universe really need to constantly tell us why He's in charge and then prove how strong He was? That is why the literal Bible is nonsense. It cannot logically be inspired by a real being capable of such great things. Satan is there to remind us of the stupidity of subjecting ourselves to authority figures who must explain why they should be in charge.

I'll burn for this one!

Xander

You know what's funny?

I wonder what religion the world will have in another couple millenia. Say, 4002.

Too bad I'll not remember this life then. It'd be funny to see what the archeologists of the future think of the christianity movement. Would they give it any more credit than the Druids got? The Greeks or Egyptians? Mayans? Or just be dismissed entirely as an interesting footnote in history?

It's an interesting point that Christianity to date has produced no lasting monuments to testify to its pervasiveness. No Stonehenge. No Sphinx. Maybe the cathedrals will last to testify to what once was...

Xander F
(Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)
A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
--George Santayana

Soledad

This is also why the Free Will concept among Christians is such a crock. How can you freely make a choice if you are punished or rewarded when you choose?

I have had that debate with my mother for YEARS now--is there such a thing as free will? I ask everyday. BTW great post! Im gonna burn too, believe me!

What the head makes cloudy the heart makes very clear.

We judge ourselves by our intentions; others judge us by our actions

plmkrzy

Satan, the very few times he actually appears in the Bible, always seemed like the voice of reason

Well no duh!

Have you ever heard that ol' saying "Keep your friends close but kepp your enemies closer"?

The very way that is accomplished is through a "Voice of reason"

Love is one of life's mysteries, like lightning, it never strikes. For others, like lightning, it strikes several times. So wear a rubber crash helmet

Carmel

Xander,

Libraries!

carmel

oh dam, the electrons are replacing the archives..............

Deleted

Leander,

The simple truth is that there is no Satan. Read Elaine Pagels' Origin of Satan and get the relief (as I did) that there's nothing there, nothing to worry about. It's all a bunch of stories fit for the times they were told, like Robin Hood.

Peace

Deleted

crownboy

Liberty said:

Hence Ol'Jehover is the stupid brute killer God always throwing a tantrum and whining that no one accepts His legitimate authority. Would a Super Being creator of the Universe really need to constantly tell us why He's in charge and then prove how strong He was?

So true, man. At the bookstudy this week, we discussed how God allowed the Isrealites to suffer because they disobeyed him, and how at the end of the current "system" all the people of the earth "will know the name of Jehovah". What is up with God's inferiority complex? Why does he constantly need us humans to tell him "you da man"? As Leander brought out, why does he need to prove anything to Satan? If God gave the Isrealites all those signs, why the hell did they not worship him anyway? Were those inconsequential gods of wood & stone so damned appealing? Was ole Marduk so charismatic that he could out do "the only true God"? If these stories were true, that would mean the Isrealites were one of the most assinine groups of people ever to live. Not mearly "unholy" as is presently preached, but down right stupid. Even in todays skeptical society we would accept God if he performed real life miracles, etc., so why the hell would ignorant Semites from 3000 years ago stop worshiping such a powerful being? (Maybe because he let their kids get torn up by she-bears for a frivilious reason ) Obviously, either God(at least of the bible) does not exist, or he's too much of a jerk to respect. A whole nation of people simply could not be that stupid, and still be capable of herding their own sheep .

As was also pointed out, given the fact that Satan has allegedly misled all but 6 million or 1.6 billion (depending on your Christain outlook), it seems to me that he has won the bet. God needs to hire new PR men to appeal to people, because his representatives have done a bad job. Satan on the other hand, has been universally maligned, but still gains influence everyday. Maybe God should hire him as a PR man (he is the Devil, so he won't object on moral grounds, right? )

Did Satan prove God wrong? a possible bibical flaw

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