It's Foolish to Believe the Watchtower Will Always Be Around.

by kneehighmiah 57 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Vidiot

  Magnum - "The JW religion that I knew, the one that seemed more scholarly and noble, is already gone. The real excitement is gone. They have to keep coming up with gimmicks to try to keep some excitement up and the apathy down. I think it can only be downhill. If JWs really had the truth, they should be progressively more attractive to the world - like a beacon, but the opposite is taking place; they become progressively more unattractive."

  Very astute observations.

  I think more and more people are coming to those conclusions, too.
• 

  Vidiot

  QC - "They are trending like evolution, religion generally, and global warming."

  Any organism that cannot or will not successfully adapt to a rapidly changing environment is doomed to extinction.

  How does a semi-secretive, apocalyptic millennialist authorotarian high-control group like the WTS successfully adapt to the rapidly evolving, information-saturated, Wikileaks-level-transparency craving social environment of the 21st Century?
• 

  Vidiot

  kneehighmiah - "The leadership knows it and they have already cashed out."

  An impending plateau of membership growth in the developed world with the global south sure to follow (due to increased internet penetration)...

  ...and the resultant relative decrease of donation worldwide (i.e. revenue flow)...

  ...a $3B windfall from the sale of the Brooklyn properties (and God knows how much else from all the other closures and sales of branch offices)...

  ...a newly heavy focus on promoting the JWorg rebrand...

  ...a recent push to fully acquire ownership -and thusly selling ability - of as many KHs as possible (in the US or abroad)...

  ---couple with recent overhauls in the structure of local JW heirarchies...

  ...and increasingly regular reminders about potentially weird-sounding instructions that should nevertheless be followed.

  Instructions that might amount to, say...

  ...an endgame that effectively discontinues local congregations in favor of online "e-religion" afilliation (complete with streaming sermons via the WT website), with a drastically reduced, consolidated, and centralized membership at Warwick thus ensuring a cushy retirement for the GB as the WTS slowly fades into obscurity?

  You have to admit, it would be a fairly effective strategy to manage the WTS's impending stagnation and decline.
• 

  redvip2000

  ..an endgame that effectively discontinues local congregations in favor of online "e-religion" afilliation (complete with streaming sermons via the WT website), with a drastically reduced, consolidated, and centralized membership at Warwick thus ensuring a cushy retirement for the GB as the WTS slowly fades into obscurity

  Such a move would effectively accelerate the downfall of the organization. IMO what is still somewhat holding everything together is the social aspect of the organization. Without the meetings and regular association, the fabric of the society would crumble as people would distance from each other more and more. Not to mention the effect on older Jdubs who would have a hard time adapting to this concept.
• 

  villagegirl

  The catholic church survived because most Catholics feel free to go to church without devoting their entire life to the religion or being forced to agree or face expulsion. JWS do not have this option. Being a catholic requires minimal sacrifice. being a jw requires enormous sacrifice.

  kneehighmiah - This is a valid point and I agree. Small cults will always exist. And money is a big factor.

  Money and real estate. But as a mass movement, I believe it is doomed in this information age.

  It becoames increasingly absurd when the "society" and the "governing body" and their bizarre

  belief system comes under scrutiny as it does on the internet. The present appeal is a closed society

  that promises that group isolation means safety. The feelings of superiority only appeal to those

  with serious neurotic issues. Catholics are mainstream because they embrace so many other aspects

  that are positive for the participants. Catholicism is hindered by its insistance on celibacy, its medieval

  priesthood and its views on women in general. But in spite of that, they have a strong charity aspect.

  They also have great architecture and have supported the greatest artists and artisans throughout

  history. Thier views on science and the fact they burned people at the stake was their watchtower era.
• 

  Vidiot

  redvip2000 - "Such a move would effectively accelerate the downfall of the organization."

  Maybe, but as far as I'm concerned, that's already inevitable; more importantly, however, I suspect they - on some fundamental level - realize it, too.

  I'm suggesting that these recent actions are an attempt to mitigate the worst aspects of that potential decline, rather than let it get away from them and snowball...

  ...i.e. creating a financial safety net to sustain the Organization in the face of potential collapse.

  redvip2000 - "IMO what is still somewhat holding everything together is the social aspect of the organization. Without the meetings and regular association, the fabric of the society would crumble as people would distance from each other more and more."

  They've already minimized and marginilized virtually every social aspect the R&F could get out of being JWs.

  redvip2000 - "Not to mention the effect on older Jdubs who would have a hard time adapting to this concept."

  Do you seriously think the WTS is overly concerned with the adaptability of older JWs? A wolf caught in a trap will gnaw its own foot off to get away.

  The WTS is concerned with survival.
• 

  steve2

  Dumb people continue to believe dumb things.

  Logic and critical-thinking have absolutely nothing to do with a religious organization's existence, honey.

  That said, it would be safe to conclude the Witnesses' organization is well past its rapid growth heyday.

  Those of us door-knocking in the late 60s through mid-70s will know what I mean:

  We covered metropolitan and rural territory every few weeks and "new ones" were quickly joining us door-to-door in rapidly growing numbers. Carloads hit the territory in dramatic fashion. Children, adolescents and young adult Witnesses predominated. The "oldies" were outnumbered. Bible-studies with the blue "bombshell" (the compact and mesmerizing "Truth" book), baptisms and publisher numbers mushroomed leading up to 1975. That state of progress will never be repeated in the organization.
• 

  LostGeneration

  To any who believe the WT is going away, I'd say go back a dozen years or so and read some of the UN-NGO threads. Rumors of the demise of the WT have been greatly exaggerated.

  Nobody here wants to read this, I'd say they have adapted nicely in the last few years. Massive reductions in expenses, huge cash inflows from property and now the new building fund. Just notice on another thread a congo send off more than $25k and pledged another $1100 a month until Armageddon, and we all know how long that will be. Not all US/UK congos will go that high, but this plan is a golden goose.

  They needed to insitute some sort of tithe, but just not call it a tithe. Send out yearly reminders and the resolutions will creep up in $ amounts.

  Membership is another thing, but I think its all about keeping them in, not recruiting outsiders any more. Watch new light flash forth saying people should have more kids in the next decade and they are set long term.
• 

  jookbeard

  I think it will still be around in some shape of form , but it will continue to change, my father always used to boast that " if I was the only JW in the entire world I'd still believe it" how many still have that mindset ? tons of them. The WT of my childhood is unreconisable to the WT of today, we will wait.
• 

  kneehighmiah

  Lost generation, having kids won't help them. The overwhelming majority of kids in my area have left. The growth rate of the religion has decreased. The peak memorial attendance occurred in 2011. Go check that out. This means they have lost their ability to recruit and add new members even from within. I'm an internet savvy young guy but I never even heard of Jwnet until this year. The marking talk in Salem shows that the effects of the internet on the organization are just now being felt. They have money now, so I doubt they're to worried about decrease I'm membership.As I've said before, when you approach retirement advisors suggest a portfolio that heavily features income producing funds/stock. You don't have time to wait for growth stocks, and you'll need the income to supplement Retirement. This is exactly what the WTS has done. Steady cash flow and 100% control of properties which they can convert to cash as their membership declines. It's an excellent strategy, but it's clearly an endgame appRoach. Less schools, less conventions,less branches, less literature, no more RBC.