Scriptural Basis for Obedience to GB? (page 3)

DesirousOfChange

Why now in the 20th century does god decide to use a team of men to explain the bible message? It seems dangerous to use imperfect men, so why notuse the bible alone?'

They would just quote the account of the Ethiopian Eunuch in Isaiah.

Doc

Yes, exactly, Ucantnome. The proof of the GB being the rightful leadership is supposed to be the insight they have into the Scriptures' meanings and prophetic fulfillments, and the results of the organization, numbers-wise. That's why you need to break this issue down to specifically discussing the numbers and the (ever-changing) teachings, because there's no single argument against the F&DS teaching except, "It's a parable, not a prophecy", which probably won't be convincing to a JW.

Scriptures like the 'don't trust in earthling man' ones sound like a good refutation at first, but the Society has plenty of scriptures stacked up on the other side like the one disposable hero mentioned, so that approach won't be effective.

SAHS

“designs”: “SAHS- you realize that the Church of Rome and the Eastern Orthodox interpret those passages just the opposite of your Protestant take on them.”

True. The Catholic Church cherishes their “apostolic succession” doctrine (supposedly from Saint Peter), as it is the linchpin of authority in their own house of cards. Although, the whole hierarchical institution of the Catholic Church didn’t really start emerging as such until well after the death of the apostles, especially from the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D. when Roman Emperor Constantine I melded “Christianity” into his secular/political administration. Thereafter came the cultural elements defining Catholicism, such as indulgences, idolatrous veneration of approved saints, etc.

The WTS has a similar claim on exclusive divine authority with their little pope-like clan. But in their case, it’s basically “same sh^t, different day” – they just happen to be “late bloomers” in the game.

Ucantnome

In the front of the book Jehovahs's Witnesses In the Divine Purpose (1958 WTB&TS of Pennsylvania) it has a list of dates beginning with 1870 when C T Russell begins studying the bible with a small group and ends with the date 1919 the release of the Society's officers from prison.

I believe 1919 is the date that is given as the date that 'From atop this celestial chariotlike organization Jehovah commissioned this dedicated, baptised , anointed class of servants to speak to all the nations in His name. Thus like Ezekiel , they became Jehovah's witnesses.' (Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah-How? 1971 WTB&TS) and you have the faithful and discreet slave from this date.

The next date listed in the front of the Jehovah's Witnesses In The Divine Purpose is 1877 the date the book Three Worlds was published and 1914 was identified as being the end of the gentile times.

In the Watchtower October 1 1983 page 4. It says.

'What do you mean by spiritual paradise? you ask. Put simply; An organization of Christians who have made over their personalities to conform to God's requirments and who are united in his true worship may be said to be in a spiritual paradise.'

As they have never changed the date of the end of the gentile times since 1877 and since 1919 the organzation of Jehovah's Witnesses has grown to what it is today in what has been identified by the witnesses as the last days in fulfillment of Isaiah 2:2-4

'It must occur in the final part of the days that the mountain of the house of Jehovah will become firmly established above the hills and to it all the nations must stream. (NWT)

Then I would present this as my basis for obedience to the GB.

( just thought i'd flesh out my earlier post)

SAHS

“Ucantnome”: “I believe 1919 is the date that is given as the date that ‘From atop this celestial chariotlike organization Jehovah commissioned this dedicated, baptised, anointed class of servants to speak to all the nations in His name. Thus like Ezekiel , they became Jehovah's witnesses.’ (Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah – How? 1971 WTB&TS)”

I thought that technically the International Bible Students Association formally adopted the name “The Jehovah’s Witnesses” at a district convention talk given by Joseph Franklin Rutherford in 1931. That book Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah – How? was actually published in 1971. It seems that the WTS likes to be consistent in their revisionalist history. This whole idea of a “Governing Body” and also the name “Jehovah’s Witnesses” were formulated well after 1919 – which proves that they were just making things up as they went along.

Apognophos

It's not revisionist if you note that the phrase "they became Jehovah's witnesses" uses a lowercase 'w'

Of course, the literature generally didn't use a capital 'w' for "Witnesses" before a certain point in time, but that doesn't take away from my point, that with a lowercase 'w', it can serve as a descriptor instead of just a name.

eyeuse2badub

We were all fooled and wanted desperately to believe. Shit happens but it don't have to keep happening. We was told what to do and just did it, no questions asked. Today, "I'd rather have questions that cannot be answered, than answers that cannot be questioned!"

just saying!

eyeuse2badub

villagegirl

SAHS - nicely put - punkofnice - frightening list proving the WT worships itself.

mrhhome

Thank you for all that information. That is very useful.

Unfortunately, it has also convinced me that the GB have their butts covered in their literature. I am not convinced that any one question will cause a JW to suddenly question the authority of the GB. Either they are ready for the TATT or not. Unfortunately, that is probably an emotional state rather than an intellectual one.

Phizzy

" Unfortunately, that is probably an emotional state rather than an intellectual one." I think you are absolutely right there mrrhome, apart from rare cases like mine, where it was in fact the doctrines falling down that woke me up.

But as most JW's who were converted were attracted for emotional reasons, and the vast majority of born-ins who remain in do so for emotional reasons, it is perhaps good to think of ways that we can appeal to the emotions of JW's, rather than troubling at all with doctrines, and exposes etc, at least in the first instance.

I am not an expert on emotions, ask Mrs Phizzy ! but perhaps others on here can suggest ways we can do this.

Scriptural Basis for Obedience to GB?

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