The bible is scientifically right saying that
the sun was standing still
in Joshuah's day in the sun.---
It still IS, [almost],----
it 's the earth that rotates, revolves.
OUTRAGEOUS statements that teach TATT, out of the WT BOX thinking, do you have one or two?
by prologos 14 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Crazyguy
Well this is a little hard to explain but we were always told that the bible writers new the earth was round before Columbus. But what that scripture is refuring to is the Babylonian creation myth were marduk killed the sepent tiamat slices her open lays her lower part of her body down as the ground or earth and raps the rest of her up and over making her like a dome keeping the water of the heaven in , the sky. So when the scripture mentions the earth being round its really refuring to it more like a plate round not a ball round, with a dome over it.
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prologos
yeah, but just in the 3 last chapters of the bible, the earth has still four corners, written on the GREEK island of Patmos, and
those geeky Greeks had actually MEASURED the circumference, the size of the BALL - shaped Earth to within 10% of its real size.
300 years before John or whoever wrote his corny 4 corner statement.
Measurement, GEO - metry wins over Marduk.
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OneEyedJoe
Claiming that the bible is scientific based on the "circle of the earth" comment always seemed suspect to me. Without knowing the mythological origin of it (thanks, crazyguy, that was interesting) I always had two problems with it. One, if the writer's goal was to be scientifically accurate, why not call it a sphere, or a ball, or something else that's 3D? It's entirely possible that the writer thought the earth was a flat circle. The second issue was, if the writer had instead said something like "all the lands of the earth lay flat before him" would we accept that the bible had some unscientific views, or would we suddenly realize that the text there is poetic and the author was using symbolism? It's just another case of pointing out the hits and ignoring the misses.
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villagegirl
TATT - Doesn't that refer to exposing the Watchtower Society and the
Governing Body and the "faithful and discreet slave doctrine" and all false
doctrines that JW's believe in ? Going straight to - "the Bible is nonsense"
might not be an approach that would win hearts and minds to convince anyone
you are the one to believe over what they now believe. If that were so, all
Crisis of Conscience would have to say was: " There is not God, the Bible is nonsense"
And how many people do you think that would have enlightened or drawn out of
the false teachings of the Watchtower ? What alternative are you offering ?
No faith at all ? That may not work for a lot of people. It is more difficult to
dismantle the ingrained beliefs. This board is filled with people who still use
terms like "the anointed" and think that means something special or that
144,000 are the only ones who can partake at the Memorial, because they do
not have any real grasp of what the Bible actually says to free them from this cult.
To just going straight to "there is no God" will eliminate the vast majority,
who will see you as an evil God hating apostate.
It does not generate trust, or hope, or love.
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prologos
village girl, how about the members of BCIT (billion of Chinese in training) or UBC, that can be swayed by LOGICAL [like Pro-Logos] arguments?
arguments they have to work out in their own minds, pricked by Outrageous Statements?
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prologos
sorry, village girl, I got interrupted they were playin " --the Queen--" in Brazil.
Yes different type of peole will react approaches, I have given up of finding religious ascociation, those of my needs filled by family.
I agree too that people have to be shaken out of their wt-devotion by injustices that are so prevalent with the elder-rule. and
the sun has not moved much since that battle-day with Joshua.
it is still standing still, almost.
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villagegirl
proplogos - KIS Keep it Simple -
First Step - to assist anyone, you have
to meet them where they are.
Respect their present situation.
Believers who are JW's AND who are
suffering cognitive disonance
(the state of having inconsistent thoughts,beliefs, or attitudes)
need explanations to sort out their own dilema.
They suspect something is wrong.
They fear change. The see change as a black hole
into which they will disappear.
Their belief is mistaken for their self.
They cling to the cult to survive.
They believe the Taboos.
They are threatened in their own mind
by fear of loss of themselves and all they know.
If they do escape on their own, they retain
the isolation and separateness drilled into them
and many retain the doctrines but secretly.
They are loyal to these doctrines.
They see no other way that makes them feel justified
or comfortable. They act out in anger, pain,frustraton,
and make themselves into what they hate.
Its a miserable process. To free a mind.
Free Minds, thats what we can help with.
Core belief: #1 The governing body is God's Sole channel
#2 The "truth" is in a "visible organizaion"
#3 They have to access to God and their own salvation through this organization
#4 They need special, magical people "the anointed"
#5 The body of Christ is limited to 144,000 and they
are on the outside looking in,they do not qualify, they are not "chosen"
#6 They must not question or disobey or they will be evil.
These are the doctrines. They can be unravelled by the Bible.
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DATA-DOG
You can't help JWs by dissing the Bible. You can't go from zero to 100. Their brains will shut down. It takes years to overcome deep seated beliefs. You can't emotionally and mentally rape someone by destroying their world view, and then wonder why things did not go well.
You can, however, get them to trust the Bible more than the GB. Its an important first step. NOTHING will happen until the GB lose their magical powers. Believing the BIBLE is better that being a JW, IMO. I would rather my wife be a born again Christian than a dub.
DD