by prologos 11 Replies latest watchtower bible
What is your theory on the reason that prompted that? the intend? the hoped-for outcome?
I can not figure that out. but
since every step forward into new light leaves an indellable footprint set in hardening concrete of wt history,
why did wt put their foot into that one? it could not have been bible research!
Because by any normal person's estimation of reality, the generation of 1914 has long passed away. (A few individuals survive, but their generation has gone).
With the overlapping nonsense it gives them more time, because they can now claim that just one anointed person, who knew an anointed person Blah Blah.
It really does extend the possible time, from their point of view. Of course a kid with simply inate Critical Thinking skills would point out that their Doctrinal Emperor was stark bo**ock naked.
Phizzy, but the OVERLAPPING idea is not really related to the 'Anointed' versus 'General Population' choice they made.
The general population
probably has more unprotected copulation,
is more fertile and holds the records for longevity: 120 years plus.
They could have 20 years on Franz alone, plus the 20 years 'anointed"-- not birth date-- overlap, another 80 years in total.
1914 pus 240 = 2154. while that date might be closer to the truth, if the truth would be known,
there are other, 'present' pitfalls in that step, the footprint in the hardening mud.
Phizzy, I did not think of that:
The 'anointed' are not the record breaking seniors, so, by switching to 'anointed generation' they maintain a sense of urgency, kind of, because
its only 2075 as an upper limit for the 'anointed' overlappers, not like 2155 for the rest of us.
that would be a "just around the corner" that is just too far away,
6-15 non overlapping generations from the birth otk
For lurkers interested in this question, I posted some analytical points about this subject here, here, and here.
From the February 1927 WT until about 1951, the Society held to the idea that "this generation" was referring to the anointed. The difference was that they viewed all the 'anointed' (aka the 144,000) from 33 CE until the present time as "this generation." That idea was related to their perceived fulfillment of Revelation 7:1-3.
As to why "the anointed," rather than the general population: Besides the fact that the inexorable passage of time is really screwing with their theology, it could be that "the anointed," as a group, are much harder to define than the general population. A census can do a good job of numbering the general population. But who can number "the anointed." The only "anointed" that the GB recognize are themselves. Any other claimants are just that, claimants, of whom 'time will tell.' The GB, IMO, may believe that they would be much harder to pin down on this subject by going with "the anointed."
Bobcat
I don't think there's a deceptive reason behind this choice because I subscribe to the "captives of a concept" theory. I suppose the reason that the generation is based on the lives of the anointed is probably just because the GB wants to see themselves playing a role in Bible prophecies. Also, people who predict a date for the end of the world almost always set a date that will come before they die of old age.
Although I have to say that I'm not clear on how the GB expect to get to heaven without dying since (as prologos has pointed out) they are now teaching that the generation will pass away before the end, with the anointed being taken to heaven during the GT. So I'm not clear on whether they expect to be raised up like Elijah without dying, or if they really are saying now that they'll die before Armageddon.
If they're really saying they'll have to die first, then I guess that goes against my theory that they are defining the generation based on themselves in order to avoid death.
why did wt put their foot into that one? it could not have been bible research!
Since when has "Bible research" ever been a factor in Watchtower's theology?
I think there may be two factors at play, first trying to make the overlap a little more plausible (if it can be considered to posess any degree of plausibility at all) because it's based on the idea of those seeing armageddon having heard a "first hand account" of the start of the last days. Since folks in the world at large didn't recognize the signs of the last days (which is why they're not all JWs, or so the story goes) they wouldn't be relating those signs to the next generation (which, apparently would make the next generation part of their generation, but I digress). The annointed, on the other hand, would talk non stop and brag about being present in 1914 to anyone who'd listen. It's therefore more reasonable to think that the annointed would have shared this first hand account so vividly that just by hearing their story you could picture it so well that it was as if you saw the signs yourself.
The other reason is that the contrived way that they define the generation sets a fairly imminent timeline for armageddon. The firsthand account of the events of 1914 has to come from someone who had already recieved their heavenly calling by that time, i.e. they were annointed partakers in 1914. Since in those days, most of the annointed where still coming from new converts (instead of born-ins like now) it's reasonable to assume that 20 would be a pretty good lower bound on the age someone might be at when they first start partaking. So those in the first part of the generation would likely have died off by 1974 around the age of 80. Obviously there might be a few that lasted longer, but this is probably about what most dubs are going to go with. So, the next generation would've had to have been partaking by 1974 in order to be a part of the generation, if you go another 60 years (again, for a total lifespan of 80) you wind up at about 2034 as the upper limit that this system can reach. The general assumption is that it'd happen well before that time due to the unexpected hanging paradox (i.e. if Jehovah waited until 2034, we'd know it must be coming then and Jesus' words about it coming at an hour you don't expect would prove false).
I expect the speculation about 2034 to ramp up in about 10 or 12 years, with subtle emphasis on a parallel with Noah's 120 year ministry (I think this has been mentioned before here as well). They're ripe for a new date setting extravaganza, since by then most of the GB willl probably only barely remember the 1975 fiasco (and what they do remember, they probably have pushed out of their minds).
OneEyedjoe,
I like your explanation. It certainly does look like 2034 is begging to be the next big road marker.
The Noah thing is there, but I hadn't thought of the overlap equation pointing to the same year.
I tell you this... They can enjoy the next date-setting debacle without me!
-TE
Two problems, Joe.
The Watch Tower Society taught that the End Times began in 1799 until 1929.
More importantly: What of Luke 21:28? "As these things start to occur, raise yorselves erect and lift YOUR heads up, because YOUR deliverance is getting near." Are there any Witnesses alive who saw 'these things' start to occur? Could anyone honestly claim that the deliverance of anyone alive in 1914 proved to be near?
It really doesn't matter what the Watch Tower Society's interpretation of the word "generation" is -- 1914 could not mark the start of 'these things', because the deliverance did not prove to be near.
