I agree, the JEHOVAH thing reeks of Charlton Heston in a dressing gown and a wispy beard.
Why not stick with Lord God?
Englishman
GOOD AFTERNOON, JEHOVAH!
by Englishman 20 Replies latest jw friends
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somebody
expatbrit526,
:I too find the name Jehovah sticking in my throat because of the power of association.
How do we get over the sticking in the throat thing? I hate that! I feel like I'm giving the WBTS something by LETTING them make me feel the way I do about God's name. That's probably because I heard over and over that to question the "society" is to question God. And that just isn't true. It's another LIE! What group equates THEMSELVES as high as God? I only know !. And I don't want to be associated as far as baptism or idolism with them. How do we get over this? how are we able to say "Jehovah", without thinking about a printing company? !! Maybe we can help each othere. You seem to feel the stuck in the throat thing that I do. :-)
thanks, expatbrit516
peace,
somebody -
expatbrit
Somebody:
I'm not sure of your history with the WT, it's just a few months since I made a run for it. Probably there will always be an association between the name Jehovah and the WT in my mind.
But, everytime I get the sticking throat thing, I make a conscious effort to think rationally; to recognise the lie they propogate of equality to God (while at the same time claiming imperfection as an excuse for mess-ups they can't wriggle out of).
The society has hijacked the divine name and used it as a propaganda tool. "We must be the true religion, as only we use God's name!" Rot!
While translator's of the bible did not wish to use the name Jehovah, read most eighteenth and nineteenth century religious books, and you realise that the name was in common usage throughout history. Only as religion itself has become less relevant to modern society has usage of the name declined. JW's have no monopoly on the name Jehovah.Personally, I agree with Englishman. Lord God is a term I am far more comfortable with. At the same time I will use the name Jehovah when I feel it appropriate to the discussion. I will not let the WT control my speech any more, even if my throat sticks a bit!
On a lighter note, you could try watching Monty Python's "Life of Brian" over and over again. (He said Jehovah!..He said Jehovah!...)
What thinks you on ways to beat this form of WT conditioning?Expatbrit.
Edited by - expatbrit516 on 22 February 2001 22:31:53
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DannyBear
Hello conflicted,
***As a result there is a class of people out there who are so gripped by fear of doing the wrong thing or being overheard saying something improper that they can't even express their own feelings to their creator.***
This struck home to me conflicted. Even Jw's personal prayer's to God are stifled, they cannot utter words of doubt about an earthly organization, the unburdening power of prayer....is lost. So imo they are no different than Catholics working their prayer beads, saying the same mindnumbing repetive words over and over again. Even if some of the brothers try to dress up their public prayers, with new words or phrases, they dare not go beyond the scope of 'approved' prayer...lest they never have the privelge offered to them again.
They are hemmed in on every turn, unable to speak or contemplate, anything other than the party line. Is it any wonder, Jw's suffer a disproportionately high incedence of anxiety and depression?
Anyone who has tasted the true freedom that comes from exercising one's own conscience, with all its related freedoms, can never again turn over one's thinking and reasoning abilities to cultish masters.
So glad to be free.
DannyBear
DannyBear
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somebody
:The society has hijacked the divine name and used it as a propaganda tool. "We must be the true religion, as only we use God's name!" Rot!
I needed that smile!
:While translator's of the bible did not wish to use the name Jehovah, read most eighteenth and nineteenth century religious books, and you realise that the name was in common usage throughout history. Only as religion itself has become less relevant to modern society has usage of the name declined. JW's have no monopoly on the name Jehovah.
the only small bit of hisory I've read on the name is that people were afraid to use the name. it was too sacred and so they were afraid to mispronounce it.
Maybe the Jehovah's Witnesses have no monopoly on the name, but the WBTS has certain MADE a monopoly USING the name.
Personally, I agree with Englishman. Lord God is a term I am far more comfortable with. At the same time I will use the name Jehovah when I feel it appropriate to the discussion. I will not let the WT control my speech any more, even if my throat sticks a bit!:On a lighter note, you could try watching Monty Python's "Life of Brian" over and over again. (He said Jehovah!..He said Jehovah!...)
I gotta watch that. I've watched "The Holy Grail" and "And Now For Something Completely Different". I'll make "Life Of Brian" my next. :-)
:What thinks you on ways to beat this form of WT conditioning?
I dunno....I'm doing what I thinks I should do to uncondition. That's all me thinks me can do. I do what I can. You?
:Expatbrit.
peace,
somebody...( the sticky throat class)Edited by - somebody on 22 February 2001 23:21:50
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Gozz
Dannybear,
there are sure guidelines for prayers. WT articles discuss matters appropriate for prayers, especially public ones. If you read the opening page of the Mankind Search for God Book, you see a few things referred to as 'mundane'. I wondered then. Who do I talk to if I can't to God about my forthcoming exams? Besides, Christiandom has got some beautiful songs mentioning Jehovah's name. Makes one green with envy. And I woke up one morning saying - Good Morning, Father God... then the thoughts came rushing and I almost recanted. -
mommy
Good mornin
Ok we are on this topic so I have another perspective and I need everyone to be open minded. I worked hospice for awhile in Florida. If any of you know of this program it is a multi health care team that assists families that have someone that is in the end stage of a critical illness.
During this time I became quite familiar with a very dynamic family. I believe there was 9 children and tons of grand and great-grand children, and grandma was dieng of cancer. She raised her children in a christian home, and most of them displayed christ like virtues. To make a long story short, the oldest daughter was a very malicious, controling person,imo. The choices she made for her mother were very selfish in my eyes and in the other children's eyes as well. I spent almost a month day in and day out with them, they would even call me at home(which was often)The biggest thing they couldn't do was to say goodbye to her. One by one and many tears later, most of them made peace with her dieng. It seemed like as soon as we helped one family member get over the hurt the oldest sister would undo all our hard work, using her mouth to hurt them and degrade them for "letting her go" I understand this is how she was dealing with her grief, but she was not helping anyone, just trying to bring them down to her level.
The day came when the poor woman passed away and I was with the family when it happened. I saw some of the most raw emotions I had ever seen in nursing. The house was a continual wail of crying and screaming. Everyone holding each other for support, very emotional, very intense.
The oldest daughter came in to where here mother lay just minutes before she had taken her last breath. She was screaming in her face to wake up acting very manical. She then said"I am calling 911" UHOH we all new if they came they would initiate CPR and do every effort to bring her back to life. Even if we had papers in the home stating she was not to be resesitated. So the older daughter went into kitchen screaming "I am calling someone help me get me the phone!" The younger grandkids saw hope and wanted to call too. We were trying to explain to them that she was already gone, and any efforts to bring her back would only injure her body further, and also was not the grandmother's wish. Needless to say the older daughter made no attempt to get the phone, but she was ranting and raving and stirring up everyone emotions.
In walks up on of the younger daughters, the one I feel took it the hardest. She was calm as she walked up slapped her sister in the face and said,"GOD Damn You!" I was shocked and so was everyone else, there was such authority in her voice. I really believe she meant what she said. I had never heard anyone use those words like that and at first was offended. The oldest daughter picked up her things and left the house. BTW she left and made funeral arrangements at a funeral home her mother did not want. The arrangements had already been taken care of, but since she was the oldest, she canceled the already made plans and made some to suit her.
My point?.... What do you guys think of saying those 3 words? I know vengence is mine and all that, and we are not to use the Lord's name in vain. But the way she said it and the situation they were in. I can honestly say I feel she had every right to say this. But that is just my opinion. BTW I had trouble even typing that out, that is how I revere using those words together.
wendy -
Englishman
OK, me old Tractor Boy Expatbrit,
Here is the scene from "Life of Brian":OFFICIAL:
You have been found guilty by the elders of the town of uttering the name of our Lord, and so, as a blasphemer,...
CROWD:
Ooooh!
OFFICIAL:
...you are to be stoned to death.
CROWD:
Ahh!
MATTHIAS:
Look. I-- I'd had a lovely supper, and all I said to my wife was, 'That piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah.'
CROWD:
Oooooh!
OFFICIAL:
Blasphemy! He's said it again!
CROWD:
Yes! Yes, he did! He did!...
OFFICIAL:
Did you hear him?!
CROWD:
Yes! Yes, we did! We did!...
WOMAN #1:
Really!
[silence]
OFFICIAL:
Are there any women here today?
CROWD:
No. No. No. No...
OFFICIAL:
Very well. By virtue of the authority vested in me--
[CULPRIT WOMAN stones MATTHIAS]
MATTHIAS:
Oww! Lay off! We haven't started yet!
OFFICIAL:
Come on! Who threw that? Who threw that stone? Come on.
CROWD:
She did! She did! He did! He! He. He. Him. Him. Him. Him. He did.
CULPRIT WOMAN:
Sorry. I thought we'd started.
OFFICIAL:
Go to the back.
CULPRIT WOMAN:
Oh, dear.
OFFICIAL:
Always one, isn't there? Now, where were we?
MATTHIAS:
Look. I don't think it ought to be blasphemy, just saying 'Jehovah'.
CROWD:
Oooh! He said it again! Oooh!...
OFFICIAL:
You're only making it worse for yourself!
MATTHIAS:
Making it worse?! How could it be worse?! Jehovah! Jehovah! Jehovah!
CROWD:
Oooooh!...
OFFICIAL:
I'm warning you. If you say 'Jehovah' once more--
[MRS. A. stones OFFICIAL]
Right. Who threw that?
[silence]
Come on. Who threw that?
CROWD:
She did! It was her! He! He. Him. Him. Him. Him. Him. Him.
OFFICIAL:
Was it you?
MRS. A.:
Yes.
OFFICIAL:
Right!
MRS. A.:
Well, you did say 'Jehovah'.
CROWD:
Ah! Ooooh!...
[CROWD stones MRS. A.]
OFFICIAL:
Stop! Stop, will you?! Stop that! Stop it! Now, look! No one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle! Do you understand?! Even, and I want to make this absolutely clear, even if they do say 'Jehovah'.
CROWD:
Ooooooh!...
[CROWD stones OFFICIAL]
WOMAN #1:
Good shot!
[clap clap clap]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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expatbrit
Somebody:
"I'm doing what I thinks I should do to uncondition. That's all me thinks me can do. I do what I can. You?"
Yeah, me too. I'm also still learning to recognise when I'm reacting in a conditioned manner. These kinds of discussions are really helpful, though.
Expatbrit.
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expatbrit
Englishman:
LOL!!
Thanks for the Monty Python refresher.
Expatbrit,
Trying to always look on the bright side of life.