My Muslim friend's and the Koran.

by new hope and happiness 43 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Simon

  Truly moderate Muslims exist and thrive! This forum has been racist of late.

  Cobblers. Tell me what race you can convert to and apostacize from (except for African American if you are Michael Jackson ...).

  Disparaging a major world religion is not good.

  Why not? I think giving religion undue respect is worse.

  There is so much in our own tradition that is deplorable --the sacrifice of Isaac, the flood story, the rape of women, major war crimes by Israel.

  Since when is that our tradition? You are mixing some mythical stories with crimes, none of which are touted as current things to do.

  The list of questionable items could go and on. O ne can view these Biblical sources as a tradition.

  Except you can't and they're not.

  The Bible also teaches respect for parents, to love each other, not to steal, etc.

  Ah, the old "some things in religion are common sense therefore it's all sensible" argument.

  I suggest you investigate Islam, not rely on some crazy posts here. I know American Muslims. They are no threat to me or anyone else. I am tired of my personal beliefs being defined by Christian fundamentalism rather than what I actually believe. I suggest Muslims are similarly upset.

  Bo hoo to them. They should make clear then that their beliefs are very very different and distinct to those that they are confused with. If they can't do that then it's their problem, not ours.

  I suggest you go look up 'race' in a dictionary and then read about the inhuman treatment of women and minorities under islamic rule.
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  Simon

  There has been a lot of noise lately because of Ben Affleck mouthing off against Sam Harris and Bill Maher. Some commentators have tried to "address and explain the issue". But you know what?

  Not one person has manager to put up a convincing argument that anything they have said is wrong on TV or in print.

  There is a truth that many can't bring themselves to face. They want to chastise people who criticise the indefensible and in the middle of their liberal diatribes forget that free speech means people are allowed to say that "they think Islam is a vile and disgusting festering pile of rubbish".

  No ones rights are being violated when they say that - but other people's rights and lives are being extinguished when they try to say it because islam is the first and most eager to prove that the criticism it receives is 100% valid by punishing those who object to it. It doesn't have the same protections of free speech by a long, long way.

  We seem to have invented pretend liberals to match the pretend muslims. The universe has a sense of irony it seems.
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  Simon

  Here's a perfect example of liberal bias on this particular issue. Sam Harris was on Fareed Zakaria's Global Public Square show on CNN. Here is the interview on CNN's site:

  http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2014/11/01/zakaria-harris-debate-extremism-in-islam/

  If you watch it all, it sounds like the interview ends. But it didn't - they have cut it off at a point that really does Sam Harris a great dis-service and makes his response look rather weak.

  Why would they do that? The full version has the crucial explanation of the issues by Sam Harris included towards the end of the segment:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ar2IzZRCRoY

  No one ever has an answer for the real issue which is that the majority of muslims cannot leave their religion or even openly voice any questions about it without severe repercussions against them, possibly their execution. It is not a religion - it is a fascist ideology that is the nazism of our times.

  How dare anyone defend such an ideology and question any who criticise it and then have the affront to claim they stand for liberal ideals. It's disgraceful.
• 

  new hope and happiness

  Simon and Cofty :The post you commented on would have faded away without comment.

  My O.P is about cultural in our communities.

  In other words my Muslim frineds owe nothing to " Islam" and i owe nothing to " Jehovers Witnessses"

  I see a problem with immigration from Islamic countrries.

  This is the O.P and your post" Bandontherun " has taken it of topic.

  Back on topic " How do we cherish our national identity" in the land we live?

  I have learnt my " national lands" identity was also repressive to women in my childhood.

  Maybe it's best Simon closes this thread, it's too confrotational a subject for me to control.
• 

  AlphaMan

  This forum has been racist of late - BOTR

  LOL....I just come here to laugh at the liberal lunacy that hating the ideology of the Islam religion is equated with racism. Only a hypocrite would be a member of an X-JW forum and state this. I think the Mormon religion is a bat-shit craxy cult also. Tell me.....what race am I a racist against with this thinking?

  Good grief....the things that are said here against the little insignificant JW sect, and the lengths the liberals here will go to to sympathize with the Muslims.
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  humbled

  Let's keep the thread alive.

  But here was a very narrow path this thread is running on. We already have been through hot forum battles-over-Islam sparked by the recent beheadings and the solders killed in Canada.

  Now this thread deals with the practical concern of how free are our friends who are Muslim of the violent influence of the dark verses of the Quran. and will this make ourselves and our children a mark for violence if we are non-muslim and speak out in against repressive practices and violence in the name of God.

  It is a difficult thing to establish a thread and maintain dialogue instead of diatribes.

  We all know that there is a problem with violent and misogynist horrible behavior that for whatever reason has risen out of the Quran. I like this thread for the possibilities it offered of assessing ways for ordinary communities and individuals to deal with Muslim neighbors...

  If we can't manage our conversation so that we aren't constantly polarizing every fraction of discussion, then we will get no where.

  Let's continue....
• 

  new hope and happiness

  I am going to leave my O.P.

  Why, time does not permit.

  I wish Simon had a feature where we could close threads.

  Anyway before i leave this thread. I think " religion, or anything we our minds too" trys to make us see it from that point of view.

  I like being a person who fails to understand and see it from that point of view.

  I mean i am happy with my point of view and if it's 70% right well then at least i am not a fanatic.

  Now most people that are 100% right i remember from my J.W life.
• 

  LoveUniHateExams

  I agree with humbled - this thread can be good without the need for diatribes.

  So here's my opinion, for what it's worth: it's just not worth it for any of us to try to help muslims see organised religion for what it is.

  Islam needs reforming but only muslims can do this. Likewise, whatever muslims truly believe, they'll have to figure this out for themselves in their own way. Until Islam is tamed like Christianity, it's best to let them get on with it, IMO.
• 

  redvip2000

  I just saw a documentary last night on 60 minutes about radical islam, which i found truly disturbing. It addressed the issue of a growing number of muslims who are keen on world domination by Islam. The interesting thing is the fact that these folks are not living in a desert rat hole unaware of the conforts and properity of western civilzations; these folks are born in the west, and yet detest the properity and opportunity that surround them.

  More disturbing is that they don't want to just be left alone to worship what they feel like, they truly believe that the entire world must be converted to islam under shariah law, and violence is acceptable in order to get this done. I walked away from listening to what they had to say thinking that this is a much bigger issue than what i thought.

  There are many religions on earth, and although all are idiotic in some way, we can co-exist with them as we don't have to believe in them. But the game is changing with Islam, there is simply a growing sentiment from muslims that the rest of the world does not have the right to NOT be muslim, and this is a problem.

  Jehovah witnesses are not all that different in reality. They also advocate death to all non-believers but luckily, they feel Jehoober is the one who has the task of killing all non-JWs, and that's good enough for me. What is not good for me, is for folks to believe they have to take this task into their own hands.
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  AlphaMan

  This forum has been racist of late - BOTR

  Not to hijack the thread, but Band On The Run earlier in this thread basically made the claim that those here on the forum who do not like Islam were racists. Below is a gem of hers from another thread. By her own definition she is a racist against Christian Fundamentalists. Amazing that living in New York City, America she gives more sympathy & tolerance to Muslims than she does to Christians.

  I am so tired of Christianity being defined by a bunch of ignorant fundamentalist nuts. BOTR