About the ten plagues in Egypt

by runForever 45 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Crazyguy

  There is too much evidence of the bibles early writing like those in Genesis being of older Sumerian and Babylonian Myths. There is also a lot of evidence that the god gods of the bible were actually gods from the pantheon of the Canaanites El, Baal Hadad, etc. Motifs and writing found in cities like Ugarit are way too familiar and like those in the bible to be just a coincidence for me. And finally theres way too many contradictions in the bible to, example Mathew writes Jesus was born in Bethlehem but John says Galilee.

  Back to the ten plagues, Moses is said to be born then had to be put into a basket covered with pitch and floated down a river until he was found and taken care of until he became a great leader. Well Dejavu for Sargon of Akkad stated the exact same thing happen to him and he was around centuries earlier than this Moses. So like the story of the flood are we supposed to believe the newer story over the older one because our faith says so, this seems to me to be ridiculous. Your thoughts Coldsteel..
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  marmot

  I challenge Cold Steel to present a SINGLE shred of archeological evidence pointing to a group of hundreds of thousands of wanderers spending decades camped in the Sinai desert. Go ahead, I'll make popcorn while I'm waiting.
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  skeeter1

  Why does a perfect God, who has the mental ability to create the universe and everything in it, need for us to live in fear of him, kill our first born child, etc? What type of perfect God is this?

  And, thank you CrazyGuy. You saved me some typing.
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  marmot

  Some food for thought from Wikipedia:

  The consensus among biblical scholars today is that there was never any exodus of the proportions described in the Bible. [ 15 ] According to Exodus 12:37–38, the Israelites numbered "about six hundred thousand men on foot, besides women and children," plus many non-Israelites and livestock. [ 16 ] Numbers 1:46 gives a more precise total of 603,550 men aged 20 and up. [ 17 ] The 600,000, plus wives, children, the elderly, and the "mixed multitude" of non-Israelites would have numbered some 2 million people, [ 18 ] compared with an entire Egyptian population in 1250 BCE of around 3 to 3.5 million. [ 19 ] Marching ten abreast, and without accounting for livestock, they would have formed a line 150 miles long. [ 20 ] No evidence has been found that indicates Egypt ever suffered such a demographic and economic catastrophe or that the Sinai desert ever hosted (or could have hosted) these millions of people and their herds. [ 21 ]
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  keyser soze

  Why does a perfect God, who has the mental ability to create the universe and everything in it, need for us to live in fear of him, kill our first born child, etc?

  Because in spite of his omnipotence, he's still incredibly insecure.
• 

  Doug Mason

  Cold Steel,

  There is no universally accepted Bible. Do not bring in irrelevancies.

  With the OT, some bodies accept the MT, others the LXX, while we have many other sources, such as Symmachus, Symmachus and Theodotian; there is no agreement between the Church of Rome and Protestants, and you can throw the Orthodox into the mix. Consider also the TANAKH.

  Differences exist with the NT, where some swear by the Textus Receptus, others accept Westcott-Hort, others take on an eclectic mix (e.g., the NIV). Add to that the books still accepted by some Christian Churches, including the Orthodox. I believe I am correct in saying that Codex Siniaticus includes Barnabas, and the early church accepted other writings as Scripture until the Paulines dominated and accepted only their own writings as sacred.

  The Roman Catholics are the only Church to vote on which books were sacred and hence constitute the Bible. They conducted that vote at the Council of Trent in the 15th century. Ironically, Protestants accept the list of books based on Tradition.

  While it is instructive to note the writings that the early church rejected, it is also significant to note the extensive use of apocryphal writings throughout the NT. Read the book of Enoch, for example, to see its influence on the ideas of Son of Man or on the Millennium that figures in Revelation.

  Doug
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  Cold Steel

  There is too much evidence of the Bible's early writing like those in Genesis being of older Sumerian and Babylonian Myths. There is also a lot of evidence that the god gods of the Bible were actually gods from the pantheon of the Canaanites El, Baal Hadad, etc. Motifs and writing found in cities like Ugarit are way too familiar and like those in the bible to be just a coincidence for me. And finally there's way too many contradictions in the bible too, example Mathew writes Jesus was born in Bethlehem but John says Galilee.

  See:

  Does the Old Testament Teach Absolute Monotheism?
  Part 1/Part 2

  Also:

  

  The Jehovah's Witnesses were incorrect. According to Methodist scholar Margaret Barker, YHWH was the preeminent son of El, not the Father God Himself. Thus, when Jesus announced Himself the Only Begotten Son of the Father, and the great I AM, he was telling the Jews that he was the God of their fathers, Jehovah. But he was not El Elyon, the Father God.

  Most biblical scholars see in the earlier traditions a more rounded version of deity than was previously known. But those outlooks came from the Israelites and were recorded by the Babylonians. Still, without original documents, no one can prove anything.
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  Cold Steel

  I challenge Cold Steel to present a SINGLE shred of archeological evidence pointing to a group of hundreds of thousands of wanderers spending decades camped in the Sinai desert. Go ahead, I'll make popcorn while I'm waiting.

  I hope your popcorn is ready.

  First, I don't care what the biblical scholars believe or not. The best evidence was done in James Cameron's documentary entitled, Exodus Decoded, with Simcha Jacobovici.

  Also:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeSHmqSrv5o

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXf2IDS-9g0

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d90NM9tgDQE

  .
• 

  marmot

  "First, I don't care what the biblical scholars believe or not."

  Says it all.

  Also, that History Channel infomercial by James Cameron was torn to shreds by anyone with a modicum of education. Of course, this serves only to reinforce your position because you see education as a threat to your belief system.
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  LV101

  Cold Steel - so Jesus announced himself the son of the wrong Father God (Jehovah) but was right as far as the Jews were concerned.

  Seems the JW's taught God was known as many names although there were many other Gods/names, also. I don't think they're the only religion that's wrong because many refer to God as Jehovah (on TV, funerals, weddings - it's common) and unlike the Watchtower have scholars on board.

  It's confusing but according to Ugarit, Jehovah was only one of El's sons.