During a debate with a relative of mine who is an elder, i told him i had a copy of the elders manual (via the net)..the look on his face was a pictue to behold!!! His wife could not believe that an ex-dub could possibly be in possesion of the oh so powerfull elders little book of tricks.He told me that the book was for authority and only elders have that authority to have access to the information in the book, is he on a big ego trip or is he just stupid not knowing this book is available to all on the net? is,nt it common knowledge amongst elders? I think too many of the average JWs are in awe of them and view them as gods themselves, so it must be a kick in the teeth when Mr.Apostate has access to their"authority".
Are all elders stupid ????
by Blackcat 10 Replies latest jw friends
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VeniceIT
Are all elders stupid ????
UHHH yup pretty much!!!!
Venice
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waiting
No, I don't think *all* elders are stupid.
stupid: struck senseless, foolish. Dull in intellect, nonsensical.
Perhaps your relative *is* stupid. But to class *all* elders stupid because of your relative is, shall we say, stupid?
I've known *some* stupid elders. Ignorant, blunt, corrupt, honest hearted, intelligent, good/bad businessmen, good/bad husbands, good/bad fathers. Just people like the rest of us.
Because if *all* elders - all being men btw - were stupid when in the organization, they *all* would be stupid upon leaving the organization because their intelligence, or lack thereof, is within them. And we know by some of the posters here, who claim to be elders previously - they are not stupid.
Just mislead by a publishing corporation like the rest of us.
Nice to meet you btw.
waiting
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LDH
Is there a joke?
I already know the punchline, LOL.
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MacHislopp
Hello waiting,
thanks for you fair and impartial
comment. After all, if you trust someone
that you have known for a long time
and then you have evidence, proofs that
he/she/them - are not really - the
sincere, fair, honest hearted and reliable
person that you always believed to be
and you openly PRESENT the fact,you
raise specific issues with the intention
to TEST the " TRUTH", I do not think
that anyone who does that should be called
stupid...maybe something else but surely,
as you mention ,not STUPID in the sense commonly
intended i.e. " dull in
intellectual capacity "Greetings
J.C. MacHislopp
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Blackcat
Sorry if i offended anyone, calling elders stupid..should i have said ignorant,in a sense that they do,nt seem to be aware of life outside of the witness culture.Sometimes when i try to hold a simple conversation with the elder i mentioned, he appears to be on a different planet, or is that just years of brainwashing !!
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ozziepost
G'day GTBFR3, (boy, that's difficult, mate!)
That must have been some debate. The horror that he felt at the thought of you having access to this secret elders' business comes from how the org have impressed the secrecy of the big green book on the elders. Did you know that if a brother ceases to be an elder he must hand in his book (notes and all!) to the Sec. Of course, if he is ever re-appointed, he gets his book back.
The book itself is not easy to follow, from an elders' point of view. When conducting a judicial 'case' you find you have to have markers (Post-It notes are good) in the relevant pages so's you can follow the procedure.
Most of the book is not secret at all, but contains points that are freely available in the publications. One exception may be the treatment of disfellowshipped relatives. The book states on page 103:
"Normally, a close relative WOULD NOT BE DISFELLOWSHIPPED [Emphasis added] for associating with a disfellowshipped person unless there is spiritual association or an effort made to justify or excuse the wrongful course."
Many JWs would not be aware of that. The elders may have modified that by saying something like "You can't associate with any DF relative who lives outside the family home."
Instructions of threats and bullying run throughout the book.
Ozzie (who doesn't need a book of laws to tell him of God's forgiveness)
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DevilsAdvocate_DA
I would like to say that you are probably 60-65% correct in you viewpoint. But your word choice is just a little off. A better choice would be, " lack intelligence", instead of "stupid". In my opinion, the WBTS needs to either beef up an educational program for their elders on how to manage the flock of Jehovah in a honorable way or get rid of the elder system. I went into great lengths on this matter over in H20, I will not bore us with it here.
Do not get me wrong on this subject, I am not bad mouthing, nor am I apologizing for the actions of those who love this self inflicted control behavier, just trying to explain a problem or sitution that has raised its' ugly head in the past 20 years or so.
In all fairness, there are good and intelligent Jehovah's Witnesses in all walks of life. Just as there are good and intelligent individuals in all the other religions of the world. These, Jehovah's Witnesses, are the ones who are intelligent enough to stay in the back ground and watch the show. Many are right here on this forum and other forums on the web.They are doing just as their father in heaven is doing, WATCHING THE SHOW.
My God Jehovah, is not a God of secrets. He has informed us all what He expects of us out in the open--in the Bible.
If there are individuals or organizations on this earth that feel they need to have secrets, (special manuals for certain groups) because of a need of control, let them have their will. In due time all secrets are unveiled. Truth will triumph.
I would like to say it again, Jehovah has NO SECRETS, what we need to live a peaceful and quiet life (not control) has been revealed to us. If others have not come to visualize this item, for what ever the reason, let them go. Keep an eye upon ourselves. Because Jehovah is keeping an eye upon both parties. He is not doing anything, right now, but watching the show. When the show is over, He will edit the film. My hope is, that He will splice me into his finished picture, PARADISE. Only I have control over this matter.
DA
P. S. In regard to the individual elder you spoke of. If in deed he has an attitude you said he does (I do not know for I have not walked in his shoes). Let me say, as an old man, there are too many men that have been appointed (crawled out of their crib before their time. In the process have hurt themselves as well as other publishers and elders) to be elders before the congregation as a whole appointed them. For example, it was the PEOPLE of Boaz time that PLACED Boaz as an elder at the city gate, NOT Boaz. The elder and ones like him need to crawl back into their crib and re-apply Gal. 5:22
Edited by - DevilsAdvocate_DA on 7 March 2001 10:30:17
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claudia
No they do not lack intelligence. Its their emotions not their intelligence. Those are two very separate parts of a person.
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claudia
No they do not lack intelligence. Its their emotions not their intelligence. Those are two very separate parts of a person.