The "Unforgiveable Sin" For Apostate...

by Perfection Seeker 12 Replies latest jw experiences

  • Perfection Seeker
    Perfection Seeker

    The last real "meaty" witness discussion I had with my mother, she said "You must have gotten that information from an apostate website, because that is the EXACT line of reasoning & order that ALL apostates use" I said that she was rude to call me an apostate, and that I am not afraid to read information, I like to gather facts. (OH, by the way- that was BEFORE this website, now I am PROUD of being an apostate :-) Thanks everyone) ANYWAY, so I asked her what exactly the "Unforgiveable Sin" is. She said "Saying the truth is not the truth" So, I said- so if I say the witnesses aren't the truth, and really believe that, then later on , if I decide it IS the truth, Jehovah won't forgive me? She said of course he would forgive you, he's a loving god. I said- then it really isn't the UNFORGIVEABLE sin- we went round & round & round & round about it. Of course, the witnesses say Apostacy is saying the truth isn't the truth. Well, thats THEIR truth. Other religions say the only unforgiveable sin is to say there is no god!
    I liked one post in here that said every witness is an apostate, since being an apostate means leaving behind former religious beliefs.

    Main Entry: apos.ta.syPronunciation: &-'ps-t&-sE
    Function: nounEtymology: Middle English apostasie, from Late Latin apostasia, from Greek, literally, revolt, from aphistasthai to revolt, from apo- + histasthai to stand -- more at STAND
    Date: 14th century
    Inflected Form(s): plural -sies
    1 : renunciation of a religious faith
    2 : abandonment of a previous loyalty : DEFECTION

    So, yes, according to this- I am an apostate, because I have abandoned my previous loyalty to the ORGANIZATION! But, I take great offense when someone says I don't love Jehovah. I do. I am a firm believer in God, pray daily, and try to live my life according to his commandments. BUT, I am a grown adult- and can read the bible & figure out for myself. I don't need an organization telling me not to talk to certain people.
    I saw a brother of mine yesterday- he said "lets put the hostility behind us. So you don't love Jehovah & I do- we can still get together as long as you don't say negative things in front of me" I was boiling mad head to toe- and wanted to defend my love for God (Jehovah) but figured as usual, I would get no where with him.

    Maybe I have been gone too long, but what would be wrong with a witness coming in here, to see the "flip" side of the coin? Whats wrong with them taking literature at the door- to see what others believe- and then be able to help them by understanding their beliefs? I was SO afraid to even HEAR about these sites when I was a witness. Now, I think what if I had come here & read it while being a witness, wouldn't it have helped me to know what others think? Surely, it HAS to be that they are afraid of someone seeing the REAL LIGHT.

    Well, this post has gotten long, but I just take offense to the way people say "YOU'RE AN APOSTATE" in a way that they think you have no hope of everlasting life. An apostate, by REAL definition, not the WTS definition isn't a bad thing.

    Ok- well, thanks for "listening"

    Melissa

  • bad_associashun
    bad_associashun

    hi PS- did you inquire her sources when she accused you of visiting apostate websites, because that's their line of reasoning? how does she know this to be true? does she visit the websites?

    yes, as with so many other scriptural meanings & applications, the wts takes their own human view, translated for their own benefit producing a 'new & improved' version of the text-of course, better than the Bible's meaning.

    regards,

    badass/rachel

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Perfection Seeker,

    The word "apostate" is a dub thought-stopper deeply conditioned into their consciousness by their religious Masters in Brooklyn. The minute they use that word or even think that word, their brain goes into a coma and they are relieved of having to face any pesky facts they wouldn't normally like.

    If more ex-JWs would recognize this, they would understand why it is like talking to a brick wall when you tell dubs the truth about their "Truth."

    Farkel

  • SpiderMonkey
    SpiderMonkey

    I was under the impression that JWs view the "Unforgiveable Sin" as "sinning against the holy spirit." Not just viewing their "truth" as not being truth, but trying to act against the workings of the holy spirit; in their view, this would include trying to convince current JWs to leave the borg, as well as trying to convince their "bible students" not to join, etc. Something along the lines of Jesus' statement that anyone 'stumbling one of these little ones' would be better off with a millstone around their neck, etc. Their definition of "apostate" is not just one who doesn't "believe in the Truth," but one who tries to convince others that it isn't.

    I don't believe in sin at all, though, only good & bad intentions.

  • IslandWoman
    IslandWoman

    Farkel,

    The word "apostate" is a dub thought-stopper deeply conditioned into their consciousness by their religious Masters in Brooklyn. The minute they use that word or even think that word, their brain goes into a coma and they are relieved of having to face any pesky facts they wouldn't normally like.

    Good One! Thanks!!

    IW

  • Xandria
    Xandria

    We should all get T-shirts that say .. PROUD TO BE APOSTATE .. Thank you for the translation Melissa.

    I too believe in Jehovah, but not the blind zombie like obedience that goes with the WTS. Man is not god.. nor do they have total understanding or monopoly on God's Word.

    Xandria

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    The only "unforgivable sin" that I'm aware of is putting mayonnaise on a hot dog. All other sins can and should be forgiven, but that one cannot. Ever!

    Farkel

  • Celia
    Celia

    So, tell me Farkel, what do you put on your hot dog ?

    ketchup, sauerkraut ?

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Celia,

    Mustard, onions and pickles. LOTS of mustard. I'm into the basics. No snails on my hotdogs, either!

    Farkel

    Edited by - Farkel on 6 July 2002 18:49:54

  • NeonMadman
    NeonMadman
    she said "You must have gotten that information from an apostate website, because that is the EXACT line of reasoning & order that ALL apostates use"

    Obviously, she's been visiting a lot of apostate web sites and reading plenty of apostate literature, since she is so familiar with the reasonings that ALL apostates use, right? Have you questioned her as to how she gained this expertise in apostate teachings and reasonings?

    I mean, we are all members of the big apostate organization, and everyone here believes the same things, right? Whatever our leader, Ray Franz, tells us to believe? Isn't that how it works?

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