Fred Franz, still alive and running the show.

by sleepy 11 Replies latest jw friends

  • sleepy
    sleepy

    Fred Franz, still alive and running the show.

    How so?No he's not been ressurected and taken to heaven to direct Gods affairs on earth.But it is his bible that forms the basis for what witnesses believe and teach.

    Many people point to Franz as the sole author of the new world translation (with help from others) he decided how "Gods inspired word" should read to people today.What is truth and what is false in the witness mind is all down to Fred Franz.

    Even after his death it is hard for the witnesses to shake off his beliefs, to do so would mean dumping their most sacred publication and admitting they were wrong.Can you imaging a major revision of the new world translation without many of the interpretations unique to the witnesses?

    I can't see that happening for a long time yet.

    So for now Freddies word still rules.Every thing witnesses believe has to fit in with his version of the bible.Therefore he is in effect still in charge of the witnesses and their minds.

    Edited by - sleepy on 12 July 2002 12:59:24

  • gsx1138
    gsx1138

    I remember hearing about how the NWT was praised by Bible scholars everywhere because it was the most accurate translation. I don't think this is true but how would I be able to disprove it and where are these scholars that make such claims?

    gsx1138

  • NeonMadman
    NeonMadman

    Notice how the NWT used to be revised every ten years or less, but now, with Freddie gone, there hasn't been a new revision since 1984, almost 20 years ago?

    Guess the GB who are left haven't got a clue what to do with the thing.

  • Michael3000
    Michael3000

    If Freddie were still alive, he'd look like that evil professor from the Underdog cartoons...

    Simon Bar Sinister!

    Edited by - Michael3000 on 12 July 2002 17:43:11

    Edited by - Michael3000 on 12 July 2002 17:43:41

    Edited by - Michael3000 on 12 July 2002 17:44:44

  • Larsguy
    Larsguy

    Hi Sleepy.

    There are definite problems with the NWT but to suggest that their version of the Bible critically affects their doctrinal beliefs is a bit out of context. JW are known to use several other translations and even published the "Kingdom Interlinear" providing the original Greek for the NT for support of their alternative translation.

    Fred Franz' basic doctrines may still be around (they say it was he and not Rutherford who wrote those books during the Rutherford years) but they are not critically dependent upon the NWT which was created to provide a modern-English version of the Bible. Since then there have been many others which they often quote from. The influence pervades, but the NWT is basically an accurate translation in my experience.

    L.G.

  • metatron
    metatron

    The most glaring inaccuracy is the New Testament insertion of
    "Jehovah" on the basis of a few occurences in some Septuagint
    manuscripts. There is no direct evidence of this name or "Yahweh"
    appearing in any Christian Greek scripture - and a great of evidence
    against it.

    Freddy didn't like the notion of Hebrews carrying flags ( somebody
    might have saluted them!) so he hid those in the Hebrew scriptures
    pretty well.

    metatron

  • onacruse
    onacruse

    I agree with Larsguy that the NWT is "basically" as good a translation as many others, EXCEPT for hundreds of passages where it supports WTS doctrine by departing from good translation principles.

    Metatron's example of the use of "Jehovah" in the NT is a case in point. Any evidence derived from the Septuagint (LXX) is only circumstantial at best. True, some of the writers of the NT favored the LXX translation of the original Hebrew even when the LXX did not provide the most accurate rendering. However, the majority of the NT quotes of the OT ignore the LXX altogether and are direct translations of the original OT Hebrew. So the LXX was by no means universally accepted as authoritative, and it is a great extrapolation to assume that the VERY few extant LXX fragments that preserve the tetragrammaton suggest a general use of the divine name by first-century Christians. Furthermore, there is not ONE, NOT A SINGLE ONE OUT OF NEARLY 7,000 Greek manuscripts (or fragments thereof) of the NT that have anything but kurios (Lord) or theos (God) in the text, even where the OT text has the tetragrammaton. Now, if first- and second-century Christians used the divine name as a matter of course, then wouldn't the copyists of that same period have caught on and seen to it that their copies included the divine name? If God was concerned that His name be so preserved, then wouldn't He have made sure that at least some textual evidence remained as proof? Including even, perhaps, a hint about the proper pronunciation of that name?

    So, then, what purpose is served by the NWT to deliberately mistranslate some 230 times in the NT and foist the name "Jehovah"? Instead of showing respect for God and concern about His name, NWT actually shows disrespect for Him by perverting the clear historical and textual evidence that Christians very quickly, almost immediately, dropped the use of that name and reciprocally referred to "God" as "Lord" and "Jesus" as both "Lord" and "God." Those titles became virtually interchangeable, and strongly suggest the Deity of Christ. Of course, WTS will have nothing of that, and the NWT is used to muddy the waters on this fundamental doctrine.

    Other examples include John 14:14 and Hebrews 1:6. The Wescott and Hort text at John 14:14 is transliterated in The Kingdom Interlinear as "if ever anything you should ask me in the name of me this I shall do." What does the NWT do about this clear invitation by Jesus to pray to him? The second "me" is conveniently and surreptitiously dropped, and so the NWT reads "If you ask anything in my name, I will do it." Hebrews 1:6 in The Kingdom Interlinear (up through at least the second printing) translates "...let all God's angels worship [Jesus]." That rendering was soon changed, and current editions of the NWT read "...let all God's angels do obeisance to [Jesus]." In defense of the NWT, it is true that there are a few later textual variants of John 14:14 that omit the second "me," and the Greek word for "worship" in Hebrews 1:6 can sometimes mean something less than what we today consider to be worship.

    I cite these last two examples only to illustrate the predisposition WTS has to use the NWT as a tool to promote their own doctrine. That most of these doctrines predate the NWT does not absolve WTS of guilt for now promoting the NWT as the best translation on the planet, an assertion that 99.9% of JWs accept without question. For myself, I never once in 40 years heard any JW use another translation except where its reading was essentially in harmony with the NWT.

    PS: I found The Jehovah's Witnesses' New Testament (Robert H. Countess; Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Co, 1982) to be a very good source of info about the NWT.

    Edited by - onacruse on 12 July 2002 19:14:25

  • Valis
    Valis
    I remember hearing about how the NWT was praised by Bible scholars everywhere because it was the most accurate translation.

    *L* me too, remember where you heard it from? Why the WTBS of course...patting itself on the back and hoping no one would notice.

    Sincerely,

    District Overbeer

  • minimus
    minimus

    Just as Brother Russell was said to be directing the work after he died, so too Brother Ray Franz is still alive and running the show.

  • FlyingHigh
    FlyingHigh

    I think you mean Fred Franz. Ray Franz is still alive and kicking.

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