144,000 (page 2)

Gianluca

Hello Bruce,

On the other thread i asked you to proove me using only the Bible, that 144000 is a literal number. As i imagined you could not quote a single scripture.
Also I don't see what are "The signs and wonders that Jehovah gave us" that added to the Bible writings indicate to me that the rebellious angels (how do you know they are 144000??) are to be replaces by men? All these speculations seem watchtowerish (no offence intended :-) )

I beleive that the 144,000 number at Re 7:4-8 cannot be a literal number because the twelve tribes mentioned each contain 12,000 people from the tribes of Israel are not the tribes of fleshly Israel (Jews by birth), but rather figurative tribes of spiritual Israel, since "not all who spring from Israel are really 'Israel'" (Ro 9:6). If that is the case, how can 12 figurative tribes x 12,000 spiritual members totals up to 144,000 literal people?

Also most of Revelation (especialy the context in which the 144000 are mentioned) is written using simbolic language.
To me the evidence indicates that the N° is simbolic.

Just curious, have you found any "disciples" who believe in your theory?

Ciao
Gianluca

Bruce144

Hi iching,

The changes in the Bible story book are there for all to see the fraudulent acts of the GB. Glad you are checking it out. After I argued in 1966 about the wrong animal count, I was disfellowshipped 3 weeks later. In 1986 I found out my own father and three elders arranged my departure pertaining to my Army attachment and not what was brought out at a secret meeting.

Even though the GB and many elders know the truth about the 144,000 they refuse to print it, because their power will be lost overnight. As far as other members of the 144,000 having their ideas printed I am also in the dark. Besides myself and speaking to members of the GB, I only ever had contact with one anointed person, the old lady that got me in the truth. And I am very eager to meet her again.

Bruce144

Hi iching,

The changes in the Bible story book are there for all to see the fraudulent acts of the GB. Glad you are checking it out. After I argued in 1966 about the wrong animal count, I was disfellowshipped 3 weeks later. In 1986 I found out my own father and three elders arranged my departure pertaining to my Army attachment and not what was brought out at a secret meeting.

Even though the GB and many elders know the truth about the 144,000 they refuse to print it, because their power will be lost overnight. As far as other members of the 144,000 having their ideas printed I am also in the dark. Besides myself and speaking to members of the GB, I only ever had contact with one anointed person, the old lady that got me in the truth. And I am very eager to meet her again.

Bruce144

Hi Chuck,

The 144,000 are a new creation, going from flesh to spirit. We are many brethren being built upon Christ, the cornerstone. He was the first resurrected from flesh to spirit, only he went back to being Michael, now with his new name and power. Once the fallen angels were removed and he sat on his glorious throne he could call the new heirs to their heavenly places.

Twelve thousand from each of the 12 tribes was the number needed including gentiles after Christ's death. When Jesus said I go to prepare a place for you, the only places being prepared was when Michael and his angels chased out Satan and the demons. Jesus at Matt. 26: 53 shows how the angels are numbered, by legions of 12. Satan took a third of only 36 legions, leaving the 24 elders or good angels behind. That is the two-thirds of that one group that was broken up. The 144,000 are heirs of God and joint heirs of Jesus.

They will judge the fallen angels, not as men and women but as heirs or replacements, after they wickedly left the heavens for their lust and own personal power. Their deaths have already been written, but the judgment not yet completed until after the 1000 years

dark clouds

bruce
thank you, for taking the time to answer. 3 more q's.
1. what changes in the bible story book do you refer to?
2. explain the truth that you mentioned to iching about the elders and gb.
3. whats up with the 14 unclean animals? and how do they relate?

thinking this one through
CHUCK

ICHING

hi bruce - thanks for replying - for my own benefit - i understand you may have explained this elsewhere prior - but i am new here -
what's your story? - my understanding - based on what i've read of your writing to date - you are a DF'd apostate but still one of the anointed remnant? - is that correct?

i believe that it is possible for a DF'd apsostate remnant class to reclaim their A list throne reservation at christs right hand if they repent from their course of apostacy - is this your plan?

I-CHING

ICHING

bruce what do you mean by this:

As far as other members of the 144,000 having their ideas printed I am also in the dark. Besides myself and speaking to members of the GB, I only ever had contact with one anointed person, the old lady that got me in the truth. And I am very eager to meet her again.

are you saying -

A) you've never spoken to the GB and the only other member of the anointed remnant you've ever spoken to is the old lady who brought you into the truth?

or are you saying -

B) you have spoken to the GB AS WELL AS having spoken to the old lady remnant?

I'm finding it hard to understand what you are trying to communicate given the way ou've chosen to structure the wording of your statements.

thanks in advance for your reply

I-CHING

Edited by - ICHING on 22 March 2001 3:42:35

Edited by - ICHING on 22 March 2001 3:44:55

dark clouds

aChristian
this is late, but i remember imaginary numbers are used for negative roots--Algebra 2, perhaps there is a clause as to say symbolic numbers?

144,000

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