"Biting The Helping Hand..."

by silentlambs 26 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Pistoff

  waiting said:

  It's as archaic as a construction worker doing medical procedures. Well, actually, that's what's happening. Untrained men are doing medical procedures on the mind - and doing incredible damage.

  Yes indeed. The fact is that the elders CANNOT factor in a person's state of mind when considering whether or not to disfellowship them, or in handling abuse cases. Some rogue elders may use compassion and bend rules, oops sorry principles, but I have seen two sons disfellowshipped during serious depression without regard to their mental state or what being shunned and sent outside to "hell" would do to them.

  Face it. Perfection is asked of us and our children, nothing less, and that includes having perfect attitude and facts when accusing anyone of abuse. How ludicrous and criminal. And then to top it off, after saying that they are not therapists they decide when children are lying or not, whether to have them confront their abuser or not, and then make decisions without any regard to DUE PROCESS or rules of evidence. They won't let us use courts to gain justice, but won't use the elder arrangement to rule in cases of money matters even, let alone sex abuse; they just tell us to "wait on Jehovah".

  How in the hell did we ever get ourselves into this mess???
• 

  deddaisy

  JWs worship the organization, for it is their god above all goodness or decency ...---Amazing

  unfortunately, this seems to be the bottom line. For the first time in my life, I actually believe that I am more disgusted with my family for being JWs than they are with me for not being a JW.....
• 

  LDH

  Waiting, you said "he is an abuser."

  I believe his 'crime' is that he has fallen for the line of bullshit they sell. There "God's ways" are higher than "man's ways".

  The elders are unwitting victims in this little drama of the GB. They are bit players and they don't even know it.

  When an employee follows poor policies implemented by the employer, we hold the EMPLOYER responsible.

  This mess is the fault of the GOVERNING BODY, they must be held responsible.

  The person he was referring to actually related to me via marriage. ALL of the children told elders in the congregations they attended that they had been molested. He was NEVER disciplined, has NEVER done jail time, nothing. OF COURSE the children denied it all when in front of their molester.

  I'm glad to report (if you remember past posts) that my father has reported molesters to the police, because their actions are CRIMINAL in nature.

  He is no longer an elder, being one who is "taking a break." I can only hope that the REAL reason he isn't an elder anymore because he wants no part of their shit, even if it's a subconcious decision.

  I think he's just defending a belief system because he can't admit he's wrong, his religion SUCKS.

  Lisa
• 

  Big Tex

  Reading this makes me think of a similar article that appears on the front page of the The Dallas Morning News on Sunday 9/1. It was about the Catholic church's scandal with pedophile priests, specifically about the Amarillo, Texas diocese. This is what the bishop John Yanta had to say about the right to know: "The communication of the truth is not a universal right," he said. Sound familiar? Whether it's Catholics or Jehovah's Witnesses, the willingness to hide evil is astounding to me. How these men can look themselves in the mirror is beyond my understanding.

  Here's the link if you want to read the whole article: http://www.dallasnews.com/dmn/news/stories/090102dnmetamarillo.60b20.html
• 

  waiting

  Hey Lisa,

  Waiting, you said "he is an abuser."

  I believe his 'crime' is that he has fallen for the line of bullshit they sell. There "God's ways" are higher than "man's ways".

  The elders are unwitting victims in this little drama of the GB. They are bit players and they don't even know it.

  When an employee follows poor policies implemented by the employer, we hold the EMPLOYER responsible.

  This mess is the fault of the GOVERNING BODY, they must be held responsible. - lisa

  Good point - and the Governing Body is ultimately at fault more than any other person. However, (you knew that was coming, eh?) remember those parents who beat their daughter to death with a hose/rod last year......giving her "50 minus one".....twice? Who was to blame.....the parents for beating their child to death - or the organization who taught them that physical discipline was ok - even encouraged?

  Of course, the WTBTS said they were not to blame. And the parents said they were following the Bible - and the WTBTS. Both were to blame. They were partners in the crime.

  So too elders who see themselves as giving vindication to the victim by making them confront their accuser in a closed room with only other men present. The WTBTS set up the situation - thus blame. The elders are following - thus blame. I've been in that damned claustrophic room filled only with men watching me closely - and I was an adult survivor. I know the intensity - but not as a totally defenseless young child/teenager.

  We ultimately have to accept our own responsibilities in our own hearts. Your father is an *unwitting* abuser - not any different than any prison guard who follows the orders of his superiors to abuse all his prisoners.

  It's just not good enough to say "I'm innocent. I was taught that way." Abusers have been saying that since there have been abusers.

  waiting
• 

  LDH1

  Hi Waiting....

  I agree with you almost 100%.

  This issue, though, is the one that mademe realize that the JWs are a cult and have brainwashed their victims. WHY? Because honest, goodhearted men who would rather die than harm a fly have somehow been snookered into believing that their manner of "investigating sins" is Jehovah's manner.

  And, as I have stated before, the parents of the children themselves also have some culpability here--NOT that they (in all cases) knew the molestation was taking place. But those that did "committed the same crime" as my father/other elders. Instead of going to the police, they chose to let the elders handle it.

  I can tell you now, they haven't made an elder yet that could handle me if my children were molested.

  THE PATTERN WAS DESIGNED BY THE GOVERNING BODY. THEY are the bloodguilty ones here.

  "God's ways are higher than man's ways" and when you've been hearing for YEARS sometimes DECADES that you are God's right hand man.....well, you lose perspective. Period.

  I know many asshole elders, and a few elders that I would probably give my life for. They honestly think they are doing what's right.

  Your position postulates that even Bill Bowen himself was an abuser...and it just isn't true. Unwittingly, unknowingly these men have participated in crimes against children. But I personally would not go the extra step to call them an abuser. Yes, the judicial committees they sat on have done irreparable damage to who knows how many adults and children.

  Calling *ALL* of those men abusers outright, imho, is doing a disservice. Remember that at one time, we too were "abusers"--going from door to door spreading our brainwashing message of death to the unsuspecting general public.

  Without giving any confidential details over the DB, I'd say we should talk via phone. I'll send you my number via email. Bill Bowen woke up. The rest haven't woken up yet to the reality of the situation.

  Lisa

  ps check your email
• 

  waiting

  Hi Lisa,

  We're close - perhaps just the perspective difference between a survivor/victim of child abuse and mother of the same - and one who's neither. I wish I was neither, btw. But we do have a difference of opinion...lol, and I can live with that.

  I received your email, thanks. Btw, my sister, Patio is a sweetheart, much nicer than me. I'm funnier though, imho - gotta claim something!

  Catcha later.

  waiting