Changes—I'll show you mine . . .

by patio34 24 Replies latest jw experiences

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  patio34

  When leaving the Borg, it takes time for our real identities to assert themselves or we try out new things to see what fits us and our life.

  Here are a couple of things that are new to me lately:

  1) After a frightening incident a week ago (but nothing happened) I purchased a can of pepper spray . Its incredibly awful, as discovered by test spraying it in the sink and a droplet drifted into my throat. Still coughing!

  2) I purchased a video for fitness kick boxing ! I love it.

  I guess Im not trusting in God or his angels (see other thread by PopeofEruke on Protection by Angelshow does that work again? http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=35441&site=3)

  Of course, there are huge personality shifts and opinion shifts. Political interest, patriotism, etc. But these two things connected to weapons and fighting are tangibles. Heh, heh.

  Of course to use the pepper spray, it would probably really tick someone off and youd better get away. But its supposed to incapacitate them for 45 minutes. Its much better than shooting someone! Id just hope theyd never be able to find me again. My problem is that Im out walking a lot, so itd be easy to find me again. Oh well, probably nothing will ever happen again.

  Besides, even if something like that happened and I had to use the spray, Id probably get me a good treadmill and start driving more!

  What about you? Any tangible changes lately?

  Pat

  Edited by - Patio34 on 2 September 2002 12:55:31
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  Nathan Natas

  Hi Pat,

  These are positive, reality based changes from which you'll benefit. If I may, I'd like to add my two cents:

  You say,"After a frightening incident a week ago (but nothing happened) I purchased a can of pepper spray. Its incredibly awful, as discovered by test spraying it in the sink and a droplet drifted into my throat. Still coughing!"

  The reason you found it so effective is because you were not "juiced" on crack or crank or angel dust at the time and you were not in an adrenaline-fueled fight for survival. Cops today are exposed to facefuls of pepper spray as part of training and they KNOW that a tough mindset can permit a person to "function" (for good or for ill) after they've been hosed.

  But the pepper spray is better than nothing if it is used correctly. Practice holding the canister close to your body - this makes it more difficult for a perp to take it away from you. NEVER extend the arm holding the spray toward your attacker - use your other hand to keep him at a distance. The EYES are a great target for an attack by your free hand. Next would be the throat. Aim for that depression just below the Adam's apple at the top of the sternum and shove two or more fingers into that "well," attempting to push your fingers out of his back. The response will be most satisfying.

  As for fitness kick boxing, it is fun, and it is good for fitness, but it isn't going to turn you into the next champion of the Octagon. I would suggest you learn how to use a Thai kick properly in addition to the cardio benefits of the fitness kickboxing. A Thai kick is not like any other kick and can be a devastating weapon - especially after you've gouged his eyes, compromised his airway and soaked him with pepper spray.

  As for your comment that pepper spray is "much better than shooting someone" - why do you feel this way? The perp will recover from the pepper spray and attack your sister the next time, or the court will set him free after a short time and he'll escallate his violence to become a serial murderer. One well placed double-tap can prevent this and make the world just a little bit better.

  It is my sincerest hope that you - and all of my JWD friends and associates - never have to use an eye gouge, throat attack, pepper spray or Thai kick on anybody in anything but a practice session, but if you do, I want you to be the survivor of the encounter.

  ONEGAISHIMASU?

  Edited by - Nathan Natas on 2 September 2002 14:12:28

  Edited by - Nathan Natas on 2 September 2002 14:17:15
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  Xena

  I nominate Nathan to host our next self defence apostate class! Sounds like you know what you are talking about!

  Sorry to hear you had an almost bad experience patio, and very glad it was an ALMOST one! Tim used to call me paranoid because of how careful I am of my and my daughters safety, but he has finally come around to my way of thinking! I don't take any chances and am constantly watching where I am and what is around me. I think the pepper spray is a good idea, I am just worried it I got something like that Bethany might set if off accidentally!

  Changes in me since leaving? lol well Tim's parents feel the I now dress in a way to make men look at me. AKA I actually look nice! I am a lot more confident about myself and who I am and I no longer care so much what others think of me. My self esteem has taken a BIG boost lately!

  I am more independent and am slowly become more extroverted (bet ya'll couldn't tell that). When I was a JW I was very self conscious and shy. Had a terrible body image!

  I am planning on taking up belly dancing and have considered several self defence classes also, for both myself and my daughter.

  Life is good and getting better!

  Edited by - Xena on 2 September 2002 14:30:52
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  patio34

  Wow, thanks Nathan for that information! I had forgotten that cops have to take a dose of pepper spray. You're right that if someone is amped up, it wouldn't have been so bad for them. The kickboxing isn't for defense, just a change in exercise. But a self-defense class would be a good thing to consider. "It's a jungle out there," which isn't a stretch.

  How is it you know so much about self-defense issues?

  Xena, you mentioned being concerned Bethany would get the pepper spray. I thought the same thing about my grandkids. It's stored up high and they aren't at my house that much. But good point.

  Pat
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  LB

  I'm not a fan of pepper spray. It can backfire because you certainly aren't going to check the direction of the wind before you use it. I've used it in the past with poor results. My wife was grabbed by a perp in a parking lot after she got off her midnight shift at Safeway. She always carried her 50,000 volt zapper with her and she got the guy good in his arm. He didn't drop but pulled away and ran away from her. She felt that it was "better than nothing" but she worried that it could be used against her. Or that he might pull out something and really hurt her.

  She doesn't weigh 100 pounds and trust me. Even a black belt that weighs almost 100 pounds less than I do isn't going to stop me. Don't believe all those movies you see. It's a help, but, you aren't going to drop someone with it. Champions have lightening speed, the average housewife black belt doesn't. Besides once you've been punched hard usually karate becomes ineffective anyway.

  My wife has since purchased a lightweight small 38. special and has a concealed weapons permit. She is skilled with it now and takes it everywhere she is allowed to, and some places she isn't. She has a little fanny belt holster that looks like a regular fanny belt. It allows her to reach inside with her hand yet no one can see what she's up to. If she's out late, in the dark, don't approach her. She's fast and accurate. And anyone that grabs her, deserves to be shot. In my state you are allowed to shoot and kill someone that intends to harm you. All you need to do is prove you were certain they intended to harm you, and the law allows you to walk. This is the case in most states although it isn't public knowledge.

  She has taken several gun self defense classes. All have been helpful and have improved her skills. I do not reccomend anyone purchasing a handgun if they aren't willing to do some training along with the cost of the gun.

  I suppose we come off paranoid about this. But I feel responsible for my own safety. There are never going to be police around if you need help, never. Police are perfect for writing tickets and filling out crime reports and that's it. Learn to take care of yourself.

  Competence breeds confidence.
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  outoftheorg

  Good God Nathan;

  Pepper spray him-collapse his trachea-gouge his eyes- and now you want to kick him? A bit of over KILL him here? Well what ever it takes was always my motto.

  Another thing to consider here with pepper spray is the wind direction. If it is blown back in your own face it is not pleasant. Any time I used it, it was always in close quarters and we had to yell PEPPER SPRAY so the other officers could watch out.

  I have always thought that a self defense course centered on attacks would be a good thing for women to take. One has to stay with the training exercises to make this knowledge useful in the real world.

  Can't just learn it and drop the practice routine and expect it to stay with you.

  Outoftheorg
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  outoftheorg

  Hello LB.

  Read you post re. carrying a 38. It is a good weapon. Even when the state laws allow carrying one and of course if used in self defense and the threat is one that justifies lethal use of a firearm there are other things to consider. The taking of a life is a terrible thing to deal with. Even if it is justified. One must be prepared for this and consider it before having a gun. One must also be fully willing to use it to kill, or it will become the perps weapon if he takes it away from you because you could not bring yourself to use it. Then even if the criminal justice system finds it to be a justified homicide, there is a good chance the perps family will bring a civil suit "urged on by a lawyer" against you and even then, if you win it is long drawn out and very costly.

  Don't take this wrong. I don't intend to criticize your wifes choice to carry a weapon. I just think it is good to describe the things one needs to consider if one of the viewers here decide to carry a gun.

  I found your post about the stun gun interesting. I don't have any experience with them.

  Outoftheorg
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  LB

  yep that stun gun was a big dissapointment. I think it's a good weapon for a situation where you know you are going to use it. Such as in taking down someone you intend to arrest, hopefully from behind.

  My wife seems prepared to take a life to save her own. But, as I told her. Better to spend money on a consuler than a coffin. The classes she has taken have helped her to come to grips with that decision, should she need to take it. At first she had lots of concerns, such as shooting an arm. But the classes have taught her that in most gun fights, inside of a room, several rounds are usually fired before anyone gets hit. Of course that's between two gunman, such as an armed felon and a cop. I know one cop that was in a firefight, less than 50 feet apart and emptied his clip and had to reload before finally striking the gunman. He was aiming for dead center too, not a limb. He is usually a very very good shot. But when someone is firing back you tend to get a bit hyper.

  So she is convinced the gun comes out to shoot, the shooting is intended to kill.
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  TheSurvivor

  Way to go patio34! Now what you need to do is enrole in a self-defense class. One that does NOT suggest your defense should be a cell phone and a whistle. Nathan made some really good points, but let me add some more. BTW, I think Nathan and I would get along REAL good. (Nathan, do a search on "Guns" and read my post under "what is your favorite?") <G> The pepper spray is a good place to start. Let me share with you what I told my wife when I got her a can....."Remember, if they can touch you, they can kill you. They don't even need a gun or knife. If someone starts to approach you, and they look like they mean you harm, or they are just making you very nevous, tell them in a loud voice to STOP, do not come any closer. Then if they take one more step, let them have it." But remember, the spray is not a magic spray. It could have the effect of just REALLY pissing them off. I say have a back up of a "big stick." Remember the key words "Fear of GREAT bodily harm or DEATH." If you think you could convince a jury that you were afraid of this, and they believe they would have been also, there are no holds barred. But it is ALWAYS better to avoid the fight if you can. But there are many decissions that must be made ahead of time. When an attacker is closing in on you, it is not the time to begin the debate about how much force you are willing to use. And above all, remember a few things......hard parts of your body, to soft parts of your opponent. And there is no such thing as a fair fight.

  Personally when I go jogging early in the morning, there is either a .38 on my right kidney, or a .45 in a sholder holster. (Legally carried.) And on my belt is an ASP collapsible batton. I will do my best to avoid trouble, but if I accidently find some I cannot get away from, I owe it to my family to do all I can do to be sure I'm the one that walks away.

  BTW, awhile back I added this to my no treaspassing sign........"A prudent man forseeth the evil and hideth himself; But the simple pass on, and are punished." Proverbs 27:12 KJV

  TheSurvivor....in more ways than one.
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  patio34

  Great answers one and all! Survivor, I thought about how mad the perp would be after being sprayed in the face. I think the gun's a great idea LB for your wife (and you too Survivor). OutoftheOrg, you sound like a law-enforcement person, ar you?

  I don't have a gun and because of the endoctrination of JWs am hesitant to consider one. But, as LB says better to spend your $$ on a counselor than a coffin. But, the main thing is safety in the home--it's the grandkids again.

  For one thing, I won't walk home after dark anymore. That's what spooked me originally. I didn't mean to be walking then, but got hung up looking at books in Barnes and Noble. Then I saw this guy who seemed to be watching me, so I went the other way and called a taxi to come and get me. Like the line in the movie Signs, "It may be an over-reaction, but I'm willing to live with that."

  Pat