Lunch with my JW sister - Topic: March on Bethel

by TTBoy 12 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

  • TTBoy
    TTBoy

    "Hey, did you know that people are marching on Bethel later this month?"

    Sister - rolles eyes - "Probobly a bunch of disgruntled DF people."

    Since most JWs ignore the problem, don't know it actually exists, or discredit anyone speaking out against them, I understand why she knows nothing. I told her that the march was for abuse victims that felt they were wronged by the elders not handling the matter properly. I really couldn't throw in that the orders were coming from the GB, that would have ended the conversation.

    Using "theocratic warfare" I admitted that the one elder is a bit outspoken (B.B.). She was mistaken in that she thought it was people who were DFd FOR child abuse who were protesting. I informed her that it was VICTIMS and SUPPORTERS who were protesting and that the DFd were young adults and elders who went to the police.

    You may find the justification and reasoning for defending the JWs interesting.

    1. "These people are just explioting the fact that child abuse is an "in" thing for the media, it's a way to get a lot of attention to discredit the Witnesses."

    2. "A letter was read from the platform that stated that in abuse cases, ONLY ONE WITNESS IS NEEDED TO BRING CHARGES!" - I would love to see this letter! I'm sorry but this completely contradicts all the cases I've ever read. She admitted that there would not be any other witness to the act so only having one witness made sense to her. Has anyone else heard that a letter was read saying that a ONE witness policy exists?....I doubt it, not according to the GB policy.

    3. "People generally hate JWs so they will try to make them look bad any way they can."

    4. "There is a difference between non-JWs and apostates. Apostates can't accept they did something wrong and are mad at JWs so they try to make them look bad." - I'm sure there are going to be EX and NON-JWs at the march. Can you find the reasoning in this thinking? I can't.

    5. "Witnesses are THE ONLY religion that does not tolerate abusers, Catholics just move the priests somewhere else and hide it." - I'll have to find some articles from news papers that shows convicted abusers who are still Witnesses in good standing.

    In summary there was basically a denial of anything wrong. There may have been cases where the elders didn't handle it properly but their policy is effective and solves the problem. Self justification that in that they are being "persicuted". The abused are most likely lying and just trying to get attention. I find it amazing that the average JW just dismisses these claims, even though I told her there were over 5000 cases. She is going to ask my cousins who are at Bethel if they have heard anything about the march. Should be interesting.

    Though in complete denial at least she now knows that there is something going on. A "march on Bethel" and other protests nation wide really got her attention. I believe that JWs are completely ignorant of the issue, maybe this march will get the attention of those who simply brush it off as persicution.

  • JT
    JT

    I believe that JWs are completely ignorant of the issue

    #

    yep- when you consider the 10's of 1000's of congo here in the USA alone- on avg let's say

    110 pubs- how many even know anything about the child abuse case beyond what they have been told by a WT rep- co , do , elder

    kinda reminds one of the communist gov-

    i used to work at the cuban embassy on contract work right after the wall fell in germany

    and i asked one of the guys there how is this playing in cuba and his response was

    They don;t know and beside it is western propaganda- so i asked him well it's being carried by all the world news org

    and he still said "western propaganda"

    so when you consider that for the most part jw can only get thier info about the org from the org- very few jw read in the Christain Science Monitor what is happening within the walls of the jw

    instead like Russian all sources of info is controled and the kicker is the avg jw likes it that way

    and that is why it is so hard to get them to read anything about the org that is not published by the org

    how sad

  • Mister Biggs
    Mister Biggs

    Hi, TTBoy.

    You can rephrase point # 4 and apply it to the JWs (my changes are in yellow):

    4. "There is a difference between non-JWs and JWs. JWs can't accept they did something wrong (U.N. scandal, child abuse cover-up) and are mad at Apostates (for exposing the hypocrisy among the JW org.) so they try to make them look bad."

  • jst2laws
    jst2laws

    TTboy,

    Good work, you are very astute for a newbie. But don't expect your sister to accept your view. She will probably have to be exposed to some reality before she will be ready to take a second look at the organization.

    Hope to see you in NY.

    Jst2laws

  • Valis
    Valis
    I'll have to find some articles from news papers that shows convicted abusers who are still Witnesses in good standing.

    Ummm...dude did you not see Dateline?

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/media.asp?site=3

    Sincerely,

    District Overbeer

  • TTBoy
    TTBoy

    I actually sent away for an official transcript and gave it to my brother. Think it's in my office somewhere. Still have to get it to her.

  • Dia
    Dia

    And there's Rodney Stark, firmly (and naively????) commited to his role in helping them in their deception of JWs everywhere.

  • ItsJustlittleoldme
    ItsJustlittleoldme

    Hi TTBoy,

    I think she played a bit of Theocratic warfare on you, either that or the organization played it on her, and she is just repeating it to you..

    ONLY ONE WITNESS IS NEEDED TO BRING CHARGES!

    Of course, anyone can bring charges against anyone else.. That does NOT mean in any way that the charges will be considered valid, and actions will be taken against the accused.. :-)

    Ask her what would happen to the person bringing the charges if NO other witness can collaborate the charges, and the accused denies the charges? If she is honest, she'll have to tell you that nothing will happen to the accused, and the person doing the accusing will probably be warned to stop being a false witness, or just plain wait on Jehovah to straighten it out...

  • abbagail
    abbagail

    Welcome TTBoy! and thanks for sharing this very interesting, yet at the same time, gut-wrenching conversation with your JW sis. Gut-wrenching in that it is so frustrating to see that BLIND WALL being expressed again and again, and knowing I would have acted just as ridiculous back "in the day."

    I think it was one of her first few comments that really got my goat, that victims just make up stuff and or are donig this just to get attention. UGH!!! Until they walk in the shoes of one who has been abused, their ignorance of the matter is, like I said, gut-wrenching.

    You're doing a good job! Keep it up, like a leaky faucet, little by little. Silentlambs' website has a transcript of Dateline I think, but I guess you wanted an "official" copy from Dateline itself? And I imagine your sis would never ever be willing to actually watch the video of Dateline online, eh? (NOT!)

    Take care,
    Grits

  • Sentinel
    Sentinel

    TTBoy,

    Hi There. It feels good to be able to get some good points across to a family member, doesn't it. It gives you some hope, that they just might have a brain of their own.

    My mother appeared to be the same way for awhile. She listened to some of my carefull remarks, and seemed to be really "thinking" about things herself. Then she got scared. She went to the elders. They set her straight of course. When the "new" "old" information was republished, the wall was reinforced and she dissed me forever.

    But, you know, we just have to try. That's all we can do. In the end, it's their loss.

    Love and Light,

    Sentinel/Karen

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