he who is sinless cast the first stone (page 2)

A Paduan

What did he say? (picking up stones)

Who cares, we are god's appointed judge - something in that book over there can be adjusted to back up our minds - don't you just hate sinners that get caught - let' s GET EM'

I guess......that it is certainly in line with everything else Jesus taught. I just see it as another way of showing that the Law was on it's way out to make way for the new covenant and it all just means to quit judging. You know, the rafter in your eye thing and judging your bro. So, i suppose no harm is done if it was added. I just can't see why it would be added because it doesn't change a thing, really. I don't know, maybe I'm missing something here? I always liked that story. I hope it really happened. dj

UnDisfellowshipped

If the Witnesses would read and really take these Scriptures to heart, they would see the Watchtower Society's Judicial System for what it is -- a false corrupted evil pile of crap.

John 8:1: But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives.
John 8:2: And at dawn, He again arrived into the Temple; and all the people came to Him. And sitting down, He taught them.
John 8:3: And the Scribes and the Pharisees brought to Him a woman having been taken in adultery. And standing her in the middle,
John 8:4: they said to Him, Teacher, this woman was taken in the very act, committing adultery.
John 8:5: And in the Law, Moses commanded that such should be stoned. You, then, what do You say?
John 8:6: But they said this, tempting Him, that they may have reason to accuse Him. But bending down, Jesus wrote with the finger in the Earth, not appearing to hear.
John 8:7: But as they continued questioning Him, bending back up, He said to them, The one among you without sin, let him cast the first stone at her.
John 8:8: And bending down again, He wrote in the Earth.
John 8:9: But hearing, and being convicted by the conscience, they went out one by one, beginning from the older ones, until the last. And Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the middle.
John 8:10: And Jesus bending back up, and having seen no one but the woman, He said to her, Woman, where are those, the accusers of you? Did not one give judgment against you?
John 8:11: And she said, No one, Lord. And Jesus said to her, Neither do I judge you. Go, and sin no more.

Matthew 7:1: Do not judge, that you may not be judged;
Matthew 7:2: for with whatever judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with whatever measure you measure, it will be measured again to you.
Matthew 7:3: But why do you look on the twig that is in the eye of your brother, but do not see the log in your eye?
Matthew 7:4: Or how will you say to your brother, Allow me to cast out the twig from your eye; and behold, the log is in your eye!
Matthew 7:5: Hypocrite, first cast the log out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to cast the twig out of the eye of your brother.

It's obvious! Jesus CONDEMNS the Watchtower Society (and everyone else like them) with these Verses!

Of course, this does not mean that child molesters and murderers and other law-breakers should not be turned in to the Police and Disfellowshipped.

It also does not mean that someone who practices something condemned by God and Jesus (for example: lying, stealing, adultery, blasphemy against God, etc.) should not be Disfellowshipped.

Earnest

DJ:

I always liked that story. I hope it really happened.

It may well have done although it seems quite conclusive that John did not record it. Bruce Metzger also said of this passage ("A Textual Commentary on the Greek NT", pp.220,221):

At the same time the account has all the earmarks of historical veracity. It is obviously a piece of oral tradition which circulated in certain parts of the Western church and which was subsequently incorporated into various manuscripts at various places.

As a matter of interest several manuscripts suggest that when Jesus wrote on the ground he wrote "the sins of every one of them". That would surely give any accuser cause to pause but I don't agree there were any ulterior motives in excluding this from the NWT. It was simply sticking to what was written.

Earnest

DJ

Hi Earnest,

Very intesting. Thankyou! dj

in3D

Eisenstein,

I discussed this same set of scriptures with a friend . . . and he brought out something that really made me think . . .

When Jesus said, "Let he who is sinless cast the first stone", and then began writing in the sand, my friend also brought out the point that even Jesus did not cast a stone, possibly saying that even Jesus is not sinless - also bringing up the fact that because Jesus has been known to be sinless, that he rightly could have throne a stone!

Well, we truly do not know this for a fact, if Jesus was sinless, although there are scriptures that say Jesus was sinless, but whether or not this is true means that we should really not be so critical and judge others so harshly. If Jesus was truly sinless, then he showed us that we should not be so self righteous or to be quick to jump to conclusions, but instead show mercy and compassion.

in3D

DannyBear

You wanna get an elder excited, you wanna get his saliva flowing? Just mention the opportunity to serve on a jc.

Oh yeah, they will loudly protest a distaste for such a need to serve, but secretly in thier heart of hearts, the mere thought of 'casting stones' (especially when accompanied with, gross sexual misconduct) a thrill, a coveted opportunity to be 'in on the dirt'.

They not only have an opportunity to chastize, berate, and humilate a fellow human, but are afforded the occassion to snub even thier fellow elder's need to know.

It is all about power and influence.

Why would they be interested in Jesus words of condemnation for such actions??????

Not very hard to figure is it?

Danny

Matty

It's funny you should say that actually, because, speaking of apocryphal scripture, I find the story of Susanna and the Elders, omitted from most Bibles in the Book of Daniel, quite fascinating:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=28830&site=3

As far as the John 8 scripture is concerned. Does anyone seriously think that those Pharisees would go away humbly after Jesus said that, and go "Hmm, fair point Jesus!". No, if it really happened, those haughty men would be lobbing the stones at the poor lady before Jesus had even finished his sentence!

UnDisfellowshipped

Matty said:

As far as the John 8 scripture is concerned. Does anyone seriously think that those Pharisees would go away humbly after Jesus said that, and go "Hmm, fair point Jesus!". No, if it really happened, those haughty men would be lobbing the stones at the poor lady before Jesus had even finished his sentence!

Good point, I thought of that also.

However, when you think about it, since Jesus was God in the Flesh, He and the Father were in control of what happened.

John 3:31: He who comes from above is above all. He who is from the Earth belongs to the Earth, and speaks of the Earth. He who comes from Heaven is above all.

John 3:35: The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand.

John 19:10: Pilate therefore said to Him, "Aren't you speaking to me? Don't You know that I have power to release You, and have power to crucify You?"
John 19:11: Jesus answered, "You would have no power at all against Me, unless it were given to you from above. Therefore he who delivered Me to you has greater sin."

he who is sinless cast the first stone

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