What Does The Bible Say About Muhammed (pbuh)?

by Muslim 19 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Muslim
    Muslim

    Galatians 1:6-9 warns that we should not receive another Gospel even if it comes from an angel from heaven. The Gospel is found in 1 Corinthians 15:1-8. It is the death (by crucifixion 1 Corinthians 2:2), burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ-The Son of God (Mark 1:1). Muhammad's "gospel" (Koran) given supposedly by an angel from heaven ("Gabrial") flatly denies these basics. Placing him under the Galatian curse.

    Paul was preahing in a city and he was telling his fallowers that after I leave do not acept another mans gospell. He was reffering to the James the brother of Jesus who was Paul's opposition, in Christianty, James preahced Unitarian Christianty which was eventually eliminated byt the empreror Contstantine. Still is in existance in a perverted form , JW's.

    Paul was reffering to the actual events of his time and not predicting or warning against the the arival of a new Gospell. There about 300 and over different Gospelss in the Paul time.

    Here is the list of Gospells that where around in the time of Paul:

    OLD TESTAMENT APOCRYPHA OLD TESTAMENT PSEUDEPIGRAPHA
    1. First Esdras
    2. Fourth Ezra
    3. Tobit
    4. Judith
    5. Additions to Esther
    6. The Wisdom of Solomon
    7. Sirach
    8. Baruch
    9. Letter of Jeremiah
    10. Prayer of Azariah
    11. Daniel and Susanna
    12. Bel and the Dragon
    13. The Prayer of Manasseh
    14. First Maccabees
    15. Second Maccabees
    16. Third Maccabees
    17. Fourth Maccabees
    18. Psalm 151
    1. The Book of Jubilees
    2. The Books of Adam and Eve
    3. Life of Adam and Eve-Slavonic Version
    4. A Fragment of the Apocalypse of Moses
    5. The Martyrdom of Isaiah
    6. First Enoch
    7. The Letter of Aristeas
    8. The Apocalypse of Adam
    9. The Revelation of Esdras
    10. The Second Treatise of the Great Seth
    11. The Testament of Abraham

      PSEUDO.ZIP -- A .ZIP file containing most of the documents

    APOCRYPHAL GOSPELS APOCRYPHAL ACTS
    1. The Infancy Gospel of Thomas: Greek Text A
    2. The Infancy Gospel of Thomas: Greek Text B
    3. The Infancy Gospel of Thomas: Latin Text
    4. A c.5th Century Compilation of the Thomas Texts
    5. An Arabic Infancy Gospel
    6. The Gospel of James
    7. The Gospel of the Nativity of Mary
    8. The Gospel of Mary of Bethany
    9. The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew
    10. The Gospel of Nicodemos (The Acts of Pilate)
    11. The Gospel of Bartholomew
    12. The Gospel of Peter
    13. The Gospel of Thomas
    14. The Gospel of Philip
    15. The Gospel of the Lord-by Marcion
    16. The Secret Gospel of Mark

      GOSPELS.ZIP -- A .ZIP file containing most of these documents

    1. The Acts of Andrew
    2. The Acts and Martyrdom of Andrew
    3. The Acts of Andrew and Matthew
    4. The Acts of Barnabas
    5. Martyrdom of Bartholomew
    6. The Acts of John
    7. The Mystery of the Cross-Excerpt from the Acts of John
    8. The Acts of John the Theologian
    9. The History of Joseph the Carpenter
    10. The Book of John Concerning the Death of Mary
    11. The Passing of Mary
    12. The Acts and Martyrdom of Matthew
    13. The Martyrdom of Matthew
    14. The Acts of Paul
    15. The Acts of Paul and Thecla
    16. The Acts of Peter
    17. The Acts of Peter and Andrew
    18. The Acts of Peter and Paul
    19. The Acts of Peter and the Twelve Apostles
    20. The Acts of Philip
    21. The Report of Pontius Pilate to Tiberius
    22. The Giving Up of Pontius Pilate
    23. The Death of Pilate
    24. The Acts of Thaddaeus
    25. The Acts of Thomas
    26. The Book of Thomas the Contender
    27. The Consummation of ThomasACTS.ZIP -- A .ZIP file containing all these documents

    APOCRYPHAL APOCALYPSES PSEUDONOMOUS WRITINGS
    1. The Apocalypse of Adam
    2. The Revelation of Esdras
    3. The First Apocalypse of James
    4. The Second Apocalypse of James
    5. The Revelation of John the Theologian
    6. The Revelation of Moses
    7. The Apocalypse of Paul
    8. Fragments-The Apocalypse of Paul
    9. The Revelation of Paul
    10. The Apocalypse of Peter
    11. The Vision of Paul
    12. The Revelation of Peter
    13. Fragments-The Apocalypse of Peter
    14. The Apocalypse of Sedrach
    15. The Revelation of Stephen
    16. The Apocalypse of Thomas
    17. The Apocalypse of the Virgin APOCLYPS.ZIP -- A .ZIP file containing most of these documents
    1. The Teachings of Addeus the Apostle
    2. The Epistle of the Apostles
    3. Community Rule
    4. The Apocryphon of James
    5. The Correspondence of Jesus and Abgar
    6. The Sophia of Jesus Christ
    7. John the Evangelist
    8. The Apocryphon of John
    9. The Narrative of Joseph of Arimathaea
    10. The Epistle to the Laodiceans
    11. The Correspondence of Paul and Seneca
    12. The Prayer of the Apostle Paul
    13. The Letter of Peter to Philip
    14. The Letter of Pontius Pilate to the Roman Emperor
    15. The Report of Pilate to Caesar
    16. The Report of Pilate to Tiberius
    17. Excerpts from Pistis Sophia
    18. The Avenging of the Saviour
    19. The Three Steles of Seth
    20. The Book of Thomas the Contender WRITINGS.ZIP -- A .ZIP file that contains most of the documents


    Paul was reffering to these gospells and not the Quran, I hope you have understood this well. If I can be further help please do ask.

    PEace!

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers

    Hey my Islamic friend has anyone clued you into the fact that the cult of Islam is nothing more than a recreation of the Aribic Moon God.....

    Contradictions and Inconsistencies of the Quran and Hadith

    by Dr. Robert A. Morey

    The debate continues to rage between Christianity on the one hand and Islam on the other. Charges upon charges are leveled between the two groups, hoping to convince each other of the superiority of their respective religious positions.

    Due to this, many Muslims have taken up the pen in the attempt to disprove the divine inspiration of the Bible by exposing the apparent contradictions contained therein. Volumes of books have been written on this very subject, hoping to demonstrate the fact that the Bible cannot be the inerrant word of God.

    Although the charges leveled against the Bible have been refuted time and again, Muslims continue to consistently present these same arguments. In this study we will not be dealing with the charges presented by Muslims against Christianity, but will deal specifically with the contradictions and inconsistencies contained within the Quranic revelation.

    The object in doing so is to show Muslims the futility in presenting charges against the Bible which only hinders the Islamic position, since the very same accusations can be used against Muslims to disprove the Quran, Muhammad and Islam. The Quran, Hadith and Islamic expositors will be quoted at length here to emphasize the point more clearly that the Quran does contain contradictions, fables and historical inaccuracies within its pages. (At the conclusion of our study we will present several book titles that deal primarily with answering the alleged contradictions presented against the Bible by both the secular and religious communities.)

    Contradictions

    Contradiction 1

    The length of a day

    S. 22:47:

    "And surely a day with your Lord is a thousand years of your counting."

    This passage contradicts S.70:4:

    "To Him the angels and the Spirit mount up in a day whereof the measure is fifty thousand years."

    Ibn Abbas, considered the premiere Islamic interpreter, was incapable of reconciling these passages together.

    Abu Ubaid said "A certain man asked Ibn Abbas about a day whose measure was 50,000 years to which he answered:

    They were two days which Allah has mentioned in His Book. Allah alone knows what they are. I do not know what they are, and I am afraid to say about them that which is not according to my knowledge.

    Ibn Abu Mulaika stated:

    I struck the camel till I entered upon Said ibn Al-Musayyab. He was asked about this (matter), but he knew not what to say. Therefore I said to him: Should I not tell what I heard Ibn Abbas say? And I told him so Ibn Musayyab said to the inquirer : ' Behold Ibn Abbas, who is more knowledgeable than me avoided to speak about it.' (1: pt.5, pp. 215, 216; citing Al-Qurtubi and Al-Razi)

    Contradiction 2

    The Day of Judgement

    The Quran indicates that human beings will be questioned on the day of reckoning:

    "So We shall question those unto whom message was sent, and We shall question the envoyS 7:6 "And halt them, to be questioned.S. 37:24

    Yet S 55:39 contradicts these passages:

    "On that day none will be questioned about his sin, neither man nor jinn."

    Contradiction 3

    The creation of the Heavens and Earth

    S. 41:9-12:

    Say : Is it that ye deny Him who created the earth in two days... and bestowed blessings on the earth and measured there in all things to give them nourishment in due proportion in four days.. Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been a smoke: He said to it and to the earth : Come ye together willingly or unwillingly.. so He completed them as seven firmaments in two days."

    These verses imply that God completed the heavens and the earth in eight days (2+4+2) and that the heavens were fashioned after the earth. Yet other passages suggest that the heavens were created before the earth and that it took six, not eight, days to complete their formation:

    "What are ye the more difficult to create or the heaven (above)? (God) hath constructed it on high. He raised its canopy, and He hath given it order and perfection... and the earth, moreover, hath He extended (to a wide expanse)S. 79:27-28,30

    Your guardian - Lord is God, who created the heavens and the earth in six days. S. 7 :51

    "Verily your Lord is God, who created the heavens and the earth in six days.S.10:3

    Contradiction 4

    Noah's family and the Flood

    According to S 21:76, Noah and his family were saved from the flood:

    "(Remember) Noah, when he cried (to us) aforetime: We listened to his (prayer) and delivered him and his family from great distress.S 21:76

    "And Noah verily prayed unto Us and gracious was the Hearer of his prayer, and We saved him and his household from the great distress, and made his seed the survivors...S. 37:75-77

    Yet, in S. 11 :42,43 and 66:10 we are told that Noah's wife and one of his sons did not survive:"...and Noah called out to his son, who had separated himself (from the rest) : 'O my son! embark with us, and be not with the unbelievers!'... and the waves came between them, and the son was among those overwhelmed in the flood."

    "God sets forth, for an example to the unbelievers, the wife of Noah and the wife of Lut: They were (respectively) under two of our righteous servants, but they were fake to their (husbands), and they profited nothing before God on their account, but were told: 'Enter ye the fire along with (others) that enter!'"

    Yusef Ali in his translation, The Holy Quran, tries to explain:

    Evidently his (Noah) contemporary world had been so corrupt that it needed a great flood to purge it, 'None of thy people will believe except those who have believed already; so grieve no longer over their evil deeds.' But there were evil ones in his own family. A foolish and undutiful son is mentioned in xi. 42-46. Poor Noah tried to save him and pray for him as one of his family, but the answer came: ' He is not of thy family: for his conduct is unrighteous.' We might expect such a son to have a mother like him, and here we are told that it was; Noah's wife who was also false to the standards of her husband, and perished in this world and in the Hereafter.(Ibid., p. 1573, ft. 5546)

    Contradiction 5

    The dwellers of Paradise

    S. 56:11-14 states that few of the later believers will enter paradise:

    Those are they who will be brought nigh in gardens of delight; a multitude of those of old and a few of those of later time..."

    This is contradicted by verses 39 and 40:

    ... a multitude of those of old and a multitude of those of later time."

    Contradiction 6

    The Position of the Jews and Christians

    S. 5:82,83 holds Jews as hostile enemies to the Muslims whereas Christians are held in the highest regard:

    Thou wilt find the most vehement of mankind in hostility of those who believe (to be) the Jews and idolators. And thou wilt find the nearest of them in affection to those who believe (to be) those who say: Lo! We are Christians. That is because there are among them priests and monks, and because they are not proud..."

    Yet verse 51 puts both Jews and Christians on the same list of people whom Muslims are to avoid:

    "O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who take them for friends is one of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk."

    The question a Muslim must ask is whether Christians are their brethren or are they to be avoided at all costs, since a person does not avoid associating with his brother.

    Fables and Inconsistencies

    Throughout the Quran and Hadith we find fables reported as actual historical events and allegations brought up against prophets that would seem unbefitting to their characters. The latter part is interesting due to the fact that Muslims constantly attack the Bible for portraying prophets in a bad light. Muslims are often offended to read stories which attribute horrible sins to prophets (i.e., David's act of adultery, Lot committing incest etc.), while failing to mention the fact that both the Quran and Hadiths do likewise. A brief listing of some of the Prophets and their sins will be presented:

    Adam and Eve

    Adam and Eve were the first sinners, disobeying God by eating from the forbidden tree which caused them to be expelled from Paradise.(S. 2:35-36; 7:19-25)

    In spite of this, Adam and Eve were also the first to associate equals with God, making them associaters (mushrikun), a sin utterly detestable to God:

    "It was He who created you from a single being. From that being He created his mate, so that he might find comfort in her. And when he had lain with her, she conceived, and for a time her burden was light. She carried it with ease, but when it grew heavy, they both cried to God their Lord: 'Grant us a goodly child and we will be truly thankful.' "Yet when He had granted them a goodly child, they set up other gods besides Him in return for what he gave them. Exalted be God above their idols.! S. 7:189-90 N.J. Dawood

    According to Islamic expositors these verses are referring to the time when Adam and Eve listened to Satan's interjections who, appearing in the form of a man, deceived the two into naming their first son Abd Al-Harth, the slave of Al- Harth,Satan's angelic name. After losing their first three sons, named Abdallah, Ubaidallah and Abd al-Rahman, they decided to name their fourth son Abd al-Harth, who lived. Thus, they succumbed to Satan's wishes, disobeying the command of the true God to stay away from him. (1: pt.5, pp.130-31; citing Ibn Abbas and Al-Tabari).

    Abraham

    The Quran and Hadiths accuse Abraham of being an idolator, deceiver and having doubts regarding God's ability to raise the dead:

    "So also did we show Abraham the power and the laws of the heavens and the earth, that he might (with understanding) have certitude. When the night covered him over, he saw a star: He said, 'This is my Lord.' But when it set, He said: ' I love not those that set.'

    When he saw the moon rising in splendour, he said,Is this my Lord? But when it set, he said: 'Unless my Lord guide me, I shall surely be among those who go astray.' When he saw the sun rising in splendour, he said, 'This is my Lord; this is the greatest (of all).' But when the sun set, he said ' O my people! I am indeed free from your (guilt) of giving partners to God.' S. 6:75-78

    (Note - To avoid charging Abraham with shirk [the association of partners with God which in Islam is the unpardonable sin] Muslims state that this occurred prior to Abraham's knowledge of the true God. This explanation is refuted by these same passages since the last verse records Abrahams statement that he will not associate partners with God anymore, implying Abraham's knowledge of the true God.)

    Behold! Abraham said : ' My Lord! show me how thou givest life to the dead.' He said, 'Dost thou not then believe?' He said ' Yea! but to satisfy my own heart!..'S. 2:260

    It is for this reason that Muhammad would say: We are more liable to be in doubt than Ibrahim (Abraham) when he said, 'My Lord! show me how you give life to the dead.' He (Allah) said: ' Do you not believe?' He Ibrahim (Abraham) said: ' Yes, (I believe) but to be stronger in faith.'Bukhari Vol. 4:591

    Narrated Abu Huraira:

    Ibrahim (Abraham) did not tell lies except on three occasions. Twice for the sake of Allah when he said, I am sick, and he said, '(I have not done this but) the big idol has done it.' The (third was) that while Ibrahim (Abraham) and Sarah (his wife) were going (on a journey) they passed by (the territory of) a tyrant from amongst the tyrants. Someone said to the tyrant,' This man [i.e., Abraham] is accompanied by a very charming lady.' So, he sent for Ibrahim, and asked him about Sarah saying, 'Who is this lady? ' Ibrahim said, 'She is my sister'.....Bukhari Vol. 4:578

    Imam Zain-ud-Din explains the nature of the first two lies:

    The idolaters invited Abraham to join them in their celebration outside the city, but he refused, claiming that he was sick. When he was left alone, he came to their idols and broke them into pieces. When the idolaters questioned him, he claimed that he had not destroyed their idols but the chief idol had, which Ibrahim left undisturbed and on whose shoulder he had put an axe to lay the accusation on it."

    (2: p. 665, ft. 1)

    Joseph

    The Quran accuses Joseph of lusting after the wife of Potiphar (named Aziz):

    "And (with passion) did she desire him, and he would have desired her, but that he saw the evidence of his Lord: thus (did We order) that We might turn away from him all evil and shameful deeds; for he was of Our servants, sincere and purified.S. 12:24

    The Bible on the other hand denies the idea that Joseph had lust in his heart, rejecting the maiden's advances by saying:

    Lo, having me my master has no concern about anything in the house, and he has put everything that he has in my hand; he is not greater in this house than I am; nor has kept back anything from me except yourself, because you are his wife; how then can I do this great wickedness and sin against God?' Gen. 39:8,9

    Job

    Job is accused of punishing his wife with a band of grass. What makes it more astonishing is that the command to do so came from God himself:

    And finally We told him: Now take in thy hand a small bunch of grass, and strike therewith, and thou wilt not break thine oath!...S. 38:44

    Muhammad Asad in his Quranic translation notes: ".... according to the classic Quran- commentators, Job swore that, if God would restore him to health, he would punish her (his wife's) blasphemy with a hundred stripes. But when he did recover, he bitterly regretted his hasty wrath, for he realized that his wife's blasphemy had been an outcome of her love and pity for him; and thereupon he was told in a revelation that he could fulfill his vow in a symbolic manner by striking her once with a bunch of grass containing a hundred blades or more. (3: p.700, ft. 41)

    Whether God told Job to hit his wife once or a hundred times is not the issue, but the fact that a merciful God would actually condone domestic violence is something which to the Christian is both an insult and an attack on the holiness of God, since the Bible portrays the Lord as a God who deals fairly with all his creatures, making no distinction between male or female, Jew or Greek (cf. Gal. 3:28; Col. 3.11)

    Another example of stories attributing sins to prophets is the story of David and the two litigants:

    And yet, has the story of the litigants come within thy kin..? As they came upon David, and he shrank back in fear from them, they said: 'Fear not (we are but) two litigants. One of us has wronged the other.. Behold, this is my brother he has ninety-nine ewes, whereas I have only one ewe and yet he said, Make her over to me, and forcibly prevailed against me in this our dispute.'

    Said David: ' He has certainly wronged thee by demanding that thy ewe be added to his ewes!.. and suddenly David understood that We tried him: and so he asked his Sustainer to forgive him his sin, and fell down in prostration, and turned unto him in repentance; and thereupon We forgave him that sin....S. 3:21-25

    This story is very similar to the Biblical account of Nathan's address to David where he too used an analogy of a rich man taking away the ewe of another in order to slaughter it for the rich man's guest. This story was told to expose David's sin who, like the rich man, had everything he could ask for and yet still took Bathsheba, the only wife of Uriah the Hittite, into his bed, impregnating her and committing adultery. On top of this, David had Uriah killed to cover up this shame from the eyes of God and the Lord sent Nathan to rebuke David of his sin. After having his sin exposed, David cried out to Nathan and said, "I have sinned against the Lord. Nathan replied,' The Lord has taken away your sin.(2 Sam. 12:1-14)

    The Muslims have consistently attacked this biblical passage as offensive and an insult to the prophethood and character of David, while failing to realize that the Quran itself bears witness to the truthfulness of this account.

    Muhammad Asad's footnote is noteworthy:

    The story which, according to the oldest sources at our disposal, is alluded to in verses 21-26 affects the question as to whether God's elects, the prophets- all of whom were endowed, like David, with wisdom and sagacity in judgement- could or could not ever commit a sin. In other words, whether they, too, were originally subject to the weaknesses inherent in human nature as such or were a priori endowed with an essential purity of character which rendered each of them ' incapable of sinning '(masum).

    In the form in which it has been handed down from the earliest authorities (including, according to Tabari and Baghawi, companions like Abd Allah ibn Abbas and Anas ibn Malik, as well as several of the most prominent of their immediate successors), the story contradicts the doctrine- somewhat arbitrarily developed by Muslim theologians in the course of the centuries- that prophets cannot sin by virtue of their nature, and tends to show that their purity and subsequent sinlessness is a result of inner struggles and trials, and thus , represents in each case a moral achievement rather than an inborn quality.(3: pp. 696-97 ft.22)

    In other words, there is no Quranic support for the sinlessness of the Prophets since the Quran confirms, rather than denies, that the prophets were men who also succumbed to sinful passions and desires like everyone else.

    Asad continues to say in regards to this Quranic narration:

    As narrated in some detail by Tabari and other early commentators, David fell in love with a beautiful woman whom he accidentally observed from his roof terrace. Upon inquiring, he was told that she was the wife of one of his officers, named Uriah. Impelled by his passion, David ordered his field-commander to place Uriah in a particularly exposed battle position, where he would be certain to be killed; and as soon as his order was fulfilled and Uriah died, David married the widow (who subsequently became the mother of Solomon). This story agrees more or less with the Old Testament, which gives the woman's name as Bathsheba (2 Samuel xi), barring the biblical allegation that David committed adultery with her before Uriah's death...an allegation which has always been rejected by Muslims as highly offensive and slanderous...(Ibid., ft.22)

    Regardless of whether David killed Uriah before or after his act of adultery, this fact is certain; the earliest Quranic expositors believed that David did sleep with Bathsheba and that Uriah was murdered at the orders of David.

    (It should be pointed out that according to the Bible David was already guilty of committing adultery in the eyes of God since he had lusted for her in his heart and according to Christ, Bathsheba was still married to Uriah regardless of death. [Mt. 5:27-28,31-32])

    Finally, we find it interesting to state that the Quran itself bears witness that Muhammad, whom Muslims claim was perfect, was a sinner in need of forgiveness. A brief listing of verses affirms this point. (S. 40:55; 47:19; 48:1-2; 80:1-11)

    Fables

    Throughout the pages of the Quran, we find fables reported as actual historical events, and stories pertaining to prophets and nations that border on myth and superstition. Here are a few examples:

    Israelites turned into apes and swines

    And well ye know those amongst you who transgressed in the matter of the Sabbath: We said to them: Be ye apes, despised and rejected.S. 2:65; 7:166

    Say: 'Shall I point out to you something much worse than this, (as judged) by the treatment it received from God? Those who incurred the curse of God and His wrath, those of whom some He transformed into apes and swine.'S. 5:60

    According to these verses, a group of Israelites were transformed into apes and swine as a result of disobedience to God's commandments, i.e. the transgression of the Sabbath. That this story is nothing more than an old Jewish fairytale is even admitted by A. Yusef Ali:

    "...there must have been a Jewish tradition about a whole fishing community in a seaside town, which persisted in breaking the Sabbath and were turned into apes.(4: p.34, ft.79)

    Mt. Sinais covering over Israel

    When We shook the mount over them, as if it had been a canopy, and they thought it was going to fall on them (We said) : ' Hold firmly to what We have given you, and bring ever to remembrance what is therein: Perchance ye may fear God.'S.7:171

    "And remember We took your covenant and raised above you (the towering height) of mount (Sinai): (Saying): 'Hold firmly to what We have given you and bring ever to remembrance what is therein: Perchance ye may fear God.'S. 2:63 (see also S. 4:154)

    The idea that God would actually raise a mountain above the Israelites in order to put fear in their hearts is incredulous to say the least.

    Islam's Al-Khazin states:

    Historians have said that when the children of Israel refused to receive the statutes of Torah (the Law of Moses), because of the burden of the commandments, Allah sent Gabriel who raised a huge mountain until it became like a canopy above their heads. Looking at it, they bowed down in worship. Everyone bowed down on his left cheek and eyebrow and began to look with his right eye at the mountain for fear it would fall on them. The Jews, therefore, worship only on the left side of their faces.(1: pt. 5, p.129)

    One should compare this tale with the Biblical account and read for themselves what actually took place (cf. Exodus 20:18)

    Solomonic Fables

    The Quran reports many fantastic details on the life of Solomon. For instance, Solomon was given power over the winds, had jinns (immaterial beings) and demons working underneath his supervision (S. 21:81-82; 38:36-38), spoke to ants and birds as one speaks to a friend, with the animals speaking back to him (S. 27:17-44), and had a lifeless body put upon his throne, forcing him to repent of his sins. (S.38:34-35)

    Muhammad Asad was forced to admit to the mythical origins of these Quranic stories:

    In this as well as in several other passages relating to Solomon, the Quran alludes to the many poetic legends which were associated with his name since early antiquity and had become part and parcel of Judeo-Christian and Arabian lore long before the advent of Islam...these legendary accounts of Solomon's wisdom and magic powers had acquired a cultural reality of their own and were, therefore, eminently suited to serve as a medium for the parabolic exposition of certain ethical truths with which this book is concerned: and so, without denying or confirming their mythical character, the Quran uses them as a foil for the idea that God is the ultimate source of all human power and glory, and that all achievements of human ingenuity, even though they may border on the miraculous, are but an expression of his transcendental creativity.(3: p. 498, ft. 77)

    Asad's other notes are even more interesting. For example, he indicates within his notes that the idea that Solomon spoke to an ant and his threatening to kill the hoopoe in S. 27:17-22 must not be taken in the literal sense:

    In this instance with the ants Solomon evidently refers to his own understanding and admiration of nature as well as to his loving compassion for the humblest of God's creatures, as a great divine blessing: and this is the Qurnanic moral of the legendary story of the ant.(Ibid., p. 579, ft.18)

    Resurrection Fables

    The Quran recounts tales of people who were put to death for hundreds of years, only to be brought back to life once more:

    Or take the similitude of one who passed by a hamlet, all in ruins to its roofs. He said: 'Oh! how shall God bring it ever to life, after this its death?' But God caused him to die for a hundred years; then raised him up again. He said: 'How long didst thou tarry thus?' He said: '(perhaps) a day or part of a day.' He said: 'Nay, thou hast tarried thus a hundred years; but look at thy food and thy drink they show no signs of age; and look at thy donkey; and that We may make of thee a Sign unto the people, look further at the bones, how We bring them together and clothe them with flesh.' When this was shown

    clearly to him, he said: I know that God hath power over all things.'' S. 2:259

    Not only was the man, who according to Islamic tradition was Ezra (Uzair), resurrected but also his food, drink and donkey were preserved for one hundred years as well.

    Another fantastic tale found in the Quran is the story of the sleepers of the cave who, upon fleeing persecution, ran into a cave with their dog where they fell asleep for over three hundred years. (S. 18:9-22.

    Even more incredulous is the Quranic teaching that Allah put thousands of Israelites to death and then proceeded to raise them back to life:

    ''Didst thou not turn thy vision to those who abandoned their homes, though they were thousands (in number), for fear of death? God said to them: ' Die'; then He restored them to life. For God is full of bounty to mankind, but most of them are ungrateful.'' S. 2:243

    ''And remember ye said: ' O Moses! we shall never believe in thee until we see God manifestly, but ye were dazed with thunder and lighting even as ye looked on. Then We raised you up after your death; ye had the chance to be grateful.'' S. 2:55-56

    Although it is true that to see God in his essential glory means instantaneous death (Ex. 33:20), what the Israelites saw was a veiled manifestation of God in a cloud of thunder and fire which caused them to drop in fear and trembling. They did not die.(cf. Ex. 19:9-24, 20:18-2, 24:15-18; Dt. 5:22-30). That this tale finds its roots partly in the Jewish oral tradition, the Talmud (a collection of uninspired writings containing many myths), is admitted by A Yusef Ali:

    We have hitherto had instances from the Jewish traditional Taurat (or Pentateuch). Now we have some instances from Jewish traditions in the Talmud, a body of exposition in the Jewish theological schools. They are based on the Jewish scriptures, but add many marvelous details and homilies.'' (4: p. 30, ft. 70)

    Inconsistencies

    Certain verses of the Quran contain statements which are inconsistent with historical places and events. For instance, the Quran mentions Abraham being thrown into fire due to his refusal to acknowledge the deities of the land and of the king. God then proceeds to cool the fire down so that Abraham comes out from the blaze unharmed. (cf. S. 21:51-70).

    It is not Abraham's passage into the fire that is at question, but it is the identity of the king who tossed Abraham into the blaze that concerns us:

    ''... traditionally the fire incident is referred to a king called Nimrud... if Nimrud 's capital was in Assyria, near Ninevah (site near modern Mosul), we may suppose either that the king 's rule extended over the whole of Mesopotamia, or that Abraham wandered north through Babylonia to Assyria.'' (4: p.837, ft. 2725)

    In Arab tradition there is the story of Abraham. Nimrud tries to burn him to death, but on account of Abraham's faith the fire became a means of safety for Abraham ...Can we localize Nimrud? If local tradition can be relied upon, the king must have ruled over the tract which includes the modern Nimrud, on the Tigris, about twenty miles south of Mosul. This is the site of the Assyrian ruins of great interest, but the rise of Assyria as an empire was of course much later than the time of Abraham. The Assyrian city Kalakh (Calah), and archaeological excavations carried out there have yielded valuable results, which are however irrelevant for our commentary.'' (Ibid., pp. 533, 1714, ff. 1565, 6055)

    Nimrud, king of Babel/Assyria (i.e., Shinar /Sumer) whom Ali is alluding to lived centuries before Abraham, making it impossible for them to be contemporaries. This fact is confirmed by both the Bible and secular history. (cf. Gen. 10:6-12, 11:10-26)

    Another example of this type deals with the idols that were worshipped at the time of Noah:

    ''And they (the people of Noah's day) said to each other, Abandon not your gods: abandon neither Wa'dd nor Suwa, neither Yaquth nor Yauq, nor Nasr..'' S. 71:23

    The problem primarily arises with the names given to the idols of Noah's time. These are the names of the idols worshiped at the time of Muhammad in Mecca, nearly three thousand years later! How is it possible for Noahs people to worship Arabic deities with Arabic titles several thousands years before these idols ever came into existence? The Muslims' attempts to reconcile this obvious anachronism have failed so far.

    Also according to the Quran, Moses and the Israelites were to wait for the Gentile prophet (or the prophet of the Gentiles) to come, bringing salvation:

    ''And Moses chose seventy of his people for Our place of meeting: when they were seized with violent quaking, he prayed: 'O my Lord! if it had been Thy will Thou couldst have destroyed, long before, both them and me : wouldst Thou destroy us for the deeds of the foolish ones among us? This is no more than Thy trial: by it Thou causest whom Thou wilt to stray, and Thou leadest whom Thou wilt into the right path. Thou art our Protector: so forgive us and give us Thy mercy; for Thou art the best of those who forgive. And ordain for us that which is good, in this life and in the hereafter: for we have turned unto Thee.'

    He said: with My punishment I visit whom I will but My mercy extendeth to all things.. That mercy I shall ordain for those who do right, and practice regular charity, and those who believe in Our signs. Those who follow the Apostle, the unlettered Prophet [1] [1] , whom they (i.e., Israelites) find mentioned in their own (scriptures)- in the Law and the Gospel; for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honor him, help him and follow the light, which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper.'' S. 7:155-157

    The obvious anachronism of the passage is the statement that the Israelites at the time of Moses were to await the coming of the Prophet of the Gentiles for guidance and salvation, whose advent was foretold in the Law and the Gospel. The question must be asked as to how it could have been possible for the Israelites to know of any prophecies of the Apostle to come within the pages of the Gospel, when the Gospel itself had not been revealed until fifteen hundred years after Moses and the Exodus?

    The argument that the passage is referring to the descendents of the Israelites who were to receive the Gospel from Jesus Christ also fails to reconcile this anachronism due to the fact that the Israelites by and large have rejected the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Furthermore, the Gospels that have been handed down to us from the Apostles of Christ are devoid of any references to Muhammad whatsoever.

    It should also be noted that Muhammad and Islam have been a constant threat and burden to both Jews and Christians alike. In a Hadith, Muhammad is reported to have said:

    '' Allah's messenger (Muhammad) may peace be upon him has commanded: Fight against the Jews and kill them. Pursue them until even a stone would say: Moslem, there is a Jew hiding himself behind me; kill him, kill him quickly.'' (5: p. 7)

    Are we to believe that this is the salvation that God promised Israel would eventually come; the idea that the God of Moses would send an Apostle to slaughter them? Far from it!

    Fuel for the Fire

    The last inconsistency that we present before concluding this study is this passage from S. 21:98

    Surely you and what you worship besides Allah are fuel of Hell ; to it you will come.'' M. Muhammad Ali

    At the surface level, there would seem to be no problem whatsoever with this verse until one realizes what the people of Mecca and the surrounding Arabian towns were worshiping. Astral worship was in vogue during that period as was Christianity and Judaism.

    Notice that the verse states quite clearly that all which is worshiped i.e., the sun, the moon, the stars, Uzair (Ezra whom the Jews worshiped as the son of God according to S. 9:30), Mary and Jesus will be cast into Hell-fire, an idea which is both foolish and blasphemous.

    Hence, we have discovered that the Quran and Traditions do contain factual errors contrary to the widely held belief amongst Muslims that Islams holy book is devoid of any contradictions or mistakes.

    What Muslims must now do to prove the Quran's inerrancy is to give positive evidence form history, archaeology, and science to refute the arguments presented within this study. In most instances, Muslims respond by committing what is known in logic as the fallacy of equivocation. What this basically means is that the Muslim response is to attack the Bible by presenting, in this case, source material from pagan civilizations prior to the writing of the Bible that contain stories which are similar in nature, i.e., the Babylonian flood and Creation epoch and the Code of Hammurabbi. This is an erroneous argument due to the simple fact that the biblical view of inspiration is different from the Muslim view. The Bible was written by over forty different authors and over a fifteen hundred year period, whereas the Quran was written by one man over a twenty three year period.

    According to Scripture, holy men of God were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write the Bible within the context of the times, using the literary style of that period. The discovery of similar stories or events within the tales of the pagan civilizations does not destroy the Bibles authority but actually reinforces it.

    That these nations also had stories of the flood and codes to govern oneself confirms the trustworthiness of the biblical events due to the fact that the other civilizations knew that these events had taken place and proceeded to adopt them within their tradition. Furthermore, the similarities between the Mosaic law and Hammurabis codes or other documents, vindicate Mosaic authorship and the fifteenth century B.C. date, since the literary style does not fit in any other time period. This then sounds the death-knell on the documentary hypothesis theory, the idea that the Pentateuch is a post-exile editorial patchwork.

    Yet the Quran denies any human source whatsoever, stating that God Almighty sent it down from heaven above. (S. 25:4-6) To find even one fable of the ancients recorded within the pages of the Quran would destroy Islam's foundation completely. This is clear from one Muslim writers statement in response to Surah 25:4-6:

    ''Apparently this is a weighty argument. For there can be no greater proof of the fraud of prophethood than to specify its source. But it looks strange that no argument has been put forward to refute this charge except a mere denial, as if to say, 'Your charge is an impudent lie: you are cruel and unjust to bring such a false charge against our messenger; for the Quran is the word of Allah who knows all secrets of the heaven and the earth.'' (6: vol. 3, pp.178-179) That the source has been specified is clear to anyone who reads this study, proving that the Quran is not the word of God.

    To conclude, we must say that the Bible has better and superior manuscript, historical, archaeological and scientific evidence than the Quran, making it more reliable than any other religious book. Hence, before Muslims try to attack the Bibles credibility, they should first attempt to prove why we should believe in their religious texts reliability and inspiration.

    Appendix A

    Fables of the Quran Identified

    As noted, the Quran denies that it contains any tales from the ancients, and calls those who make such allegations liars:

    "But the Misbelievers say: 'Naught is this a lie which he has forged, and others have helped him at it...' And they say, 'Tales of the ancients which he has caused to be written: and they are dictated before him morning and evening.' '' S.25:4,5

    The Quran responds:

    ''... In truth it is they who have put forward an iniquity ... Say, It is sent down by Him who knows the mystery that is in the heavens and the earth: verily He is oft-forgiving, most merciful.''' S. 25:4,6

    Yusef Ali elaborates:

    ''In their misguided arrogance they say: 'We have heard such things before: they are pretty tales which have come down from ancient times; they are good for amusement, but who takes them seriously?' When the beauty and power of the revelation are pointed out, and its miracles as coming from an unlearned man, they again hint at other men who wrote them, though they could not produce any one who could write anything like it.''

    and,

    The answer is that the Quran teaches spiritual knowledge which can only come from God, to whom alone is known the mystery of the whole creation.' (4: p. 927, ff. 3058, 3059)

    (It is noteworthy that throughout his commentary, Ali identifies the fables and traditions of certain passages within the Quran, disproving the very thing he tries to prove; namely no fables to be found in the revelation. [see study])

    Maulana Ali adds,

    ''In the previous verse, their allegation is that the Quran is a forgery; here they allege that the prophet had caused some stories of the ancients to be written down by some people who helped him and it was these stories which were recited to him and which he gave out as a revelation from on high. How could mere stories bring about the transformation which the Holy Quran was working in the hearts of men?..'' (7: pp. 697, 698; ft. 1771)

    It has been clearly demonstrated throughout the study that the Quran does find root in the tales of the ancients and, contrary to what Muslims are saying , contains nothing which would lead one to believe that it came down from heaven above.

    In this appendix, we will present two more factors from the Talmud [2] [2] that prove beyond any reasonable doubt that Muhammad was not being inspired but was in actuality receiving his information from different human sources.

    Talmud

    When Abraham saw the sun issuing in the morning from the east, he at first moved to think that it was God, and said, This is the king that created me; and worshiped it the whole day. In the evening when the sun went down and the moon commenced to shine, he said, 'Verily this rules over the orb which I worshiped the whole day, since the latter is darkened before it and does not shine anymore.'

    So he served the moon all that night. In the morning when he saw the darkness depart and the east grow light, he said, 'Of a surety there is a king who rules over all these orbs and orders them.'Zohar, cen. 869

    Compare,

    ''So also did We show Abraham the power and the laws of the heavens and the earth. That he might have certitude. When the night covered him over, he saw a star; he said , 'This is my Lord. But when it set, he said, ''I love not those who set.' When he saw the moon rising in splendor, he said, This is my Lord. But when the moon set, he said , Unless my Lord guide me, I shall surely be among those who go astray.' When he saw the sun rising in splendor, he said, This is my lord; this is the greatest of all; but when the sun set, he said , 'O my people I am indeed free from your error of ascribing partners to God. For me, I have set my face firmly and truly towards Him who created the heavens and the earth, and never shall I ascribe partners to God.'' S. 6: 75-79 Pickhtall

    Talmud

    ''Only one single man Adam was created in the world to teach that , if any man has caused a single soul to perish, scripture imputes it to him as though he had caused the whole world to perish, and if any man saves a life, a single soul, Scripture imputes it to him as though he had saved the whole world.''

    Mishnah, Sanhedrin 4.5

    Compare,

    ''Therefore We prescribed for the children of Israel that whoever kills a human being, except to retaliate for manslaughter or for corruption done in the land, it shall be as if he had killed all of human- kind; and who so saves the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the lives of all humankind.'' S. 5:32

    Pickhtall

    The striking similarities between the Talmudic and Quranic tales demonstrates the fact that one of Muhammad's sources of inspiration was a Jew who knew the oral traditions of the rabbis well.

    Appendix B

    The Drowning of Pharaoh In the Quran

    Another fact often given by Muslims for the heavenly inspiration of Muhammad is the Quranic foreknowledge of Pharaoh's bodily preservation and its future discovery as a sign for unbelievers:

    ''And We brought the children of Israel over the sea; and Pharaoh and his hosts followed them insolently and impetuously till, when the drowning over took him, he (Pharaoh) said, 'I believe that there is no god but He in whom the children of Israel believe; I am of those that surrender.' Now? and before thou didst rebel, being of those that did corruption. So today We shall deliver thee with thy body, that thou mayest be a sign to those after thee. Surely many men are heedless of our signs.'' S. 10: 90-91 Arberry

    Accordingly, Muslims argue that the body of the Pharaoh of the Exodus is believed to have been discovered by Loret at Thebes in the King's valley in 1898, nearly thirteen centuries after this Quranic verse was revealed. This, they claim, gives irrefutable proof for Muhammad's prophethood since it is not possible for Muhammad to have known this apart from Divine revelation.

    This argument once more reciprocates back against the Muslims, since we find this same tale proclaimed in the Talmudic fables of the Rabbis, again pointing to the fact that Muhammad was not a God-inspired Prophet:

    ''Perceive the great power of repentance! Pharaoh, king of Egypt, uttered very wicked words-'Who is the god whose voice I shall obey? (Exod. 5:2). Yet as he repented, saying. ' Who is like unto thee among the gods?' (Exod. 15 : 2). God saved him from death; for it saith; Almost had I stretched out my hands and destroyed; but God let him live, that he might declare his power and strength. ' '' (Pirke Rabbi Elieazer, xliii; Midrash Yalkut, ccxxxviii).

    If the passage is an indication of inspiration then it is the Talmudic compilers, not Muhammad, who were being inspired, since it is again obvious as to where Muhammad received his ''Revelations.''

    (Note- It must be pointed out that it is impossible for the Pharaohs body to have been discovered, since there is a difference of opinion amongst theologians as to his identity. Some scholars are of the opinion that the Exodus took pace in the 19th dynasty period of Egypt, making Seti 1 and Rameses 2 the Pharaohs of the oppression and Exodus.

    Others, citing 1Kings 6:1 as evidence, believe that the Exodus took place in 1446 B.C. due to the statement in 1Kings that Israel's deliverance from Egypt took place 430 years before, ''The fourth year of Solomon's reign over Israel'' (i.e. 966 B.C.). This would make Thutmose 3 and his son Amuhotep 2 the Pharaohs of that period.

    This is a fact that Muhammad Asad himself admits in his footnote to this Quranic passage:

    Lit. We shall save thee in thy body: Probably an allusion to the ancient Egyptian custom of embalming the bodies of their kings and nobles and thus preserving them for posterity. Some Egyptologists assume that the evil Pharaoh of the Quran and the Bible was Ramses II (about 1324-1258 B.C.), while others identify him with his unlucky predecessor, Tut-ankh-amen, or even with Thotmes (or Thutmosis) III, who lived in the 15 th century B.C. However, all these identifications are purely speculative and have no definitive historical value. In this connection it should be remembered that the designation Pharaoh (firawn in Arabic) is not a proper name but a title born by all the kings of ancient Egypt. (3:p.306, f.112)

    Even though the historical and archaeological evidence strongly suggests a 1446 B.C. date for the Exodus, the uncertainty amongst religious scholars should point out the wishful thinking on the part of some Muslims in their overzealous attempts to ''prove'' that Pharaoh's body has been found.)

    The Listing of Christian Books:

    Dr. Gleason Archer, Encyclopedia of Bible Difficulties, Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids, Michigan

    Norman Geisler & Thomas Howe, When Critics Ask, Victor Books

    Walter C. Kaiser Jr., Peter H. Davids, F.F. Bruce, Manfred T. Brauch

    Hard Sayings of the Bible, Intervarsity Press, Downers Grove, Illinois

    Robert Morey, Islamic Invasion, Harvest House, Eugene, OR

    Bibliography

    1. 1. The True Guidance - Comments on Quranic Verses

    2. 2. Imam Zain-ud-Din bin Abdul-Lateef Az-Zubaidi:

    3. 3. The Translation of the Meanings of Summarized Sahi Al-Bukhari (Arabic - English)

    4. 4. Muhammad Asad: The Message of The Quran

    5. 5. Yusuf Ali: The Holy Quran - Translation and Commentary

    6. 6. John Ankerberg & John Weldon: The Facts on Islam

    7. 7. Maududi: The Meaning of the Quran

    8. 8. Maulana Muhammad Ali: Holy Quran


    [1] [1] The word which is often translated as unlettered, ummi, is more correctly translated as ''People without scripture'' (i.e., the non-Jews and Christians) or '' Gentile'' as the Quran itself bears witness:

    ''... for they (i.e., Jews) say: 'We are not bound to keep faith with gentiles (Ummiyun)..''' S. 3:78 Dawood

    ''It is He that has sent forth among the gentiles (Ummiyun) an apostle of their own to recite to them His revelation, to purify them, and to instruct them in the book and in wisdom, though they have hither to been in gross error, together with others of their own kin who have not yet followed them. He is the Mighty, the Wise.'' S. 62:2,3 Dawood

    To assume that all the gentiles or Arabs were illiterate cannot be accepted, since history attests to the high level of literacy of the Arabs prior to and contemporary with Muhammad. This forces us to conclude that the word Ummi, when applied to both Muhammad and his times simply meant people who were ''unlettered'' i.e., not in the sense of reading or writing but in the sense that they had no knowledge of inspired scriptures like the Bible.

    [2] [2] The Talmud is a body of rabbinic teachings which were passed on orally and compiled in the second and third centuries, called the Mishnah and the Gemara. Within these traditions, one finds a variety of subjects ranging from agriculture to spiritual lessons. Also contained within these accounts are stories of the prophets and historical events which often diverge from the Biblical narratives, containing gross historical errors and anachronisms. That the Quran contains much in the way of Talmudic fables is indicative of its true source and worth.

  • Muslim
    Muslim
    "Hey my Islamic friend has anyone clued you into the fact that the cult of Islam is nothing more than a recreation of the Aribic Moon God..... "

    Here is a debate beween me and a JW missionary (after getting continious defeats he closed the site) on the subject of "What is the name Of God?" It also touches the word Allah and its use in the Bible.

    Jesus gave you a wonderfull teaching "judge not that you will be juged. by the measure you shall judge." Since allah is the moon good, so why did jesus call out for help from the same moon god, while he waas on the cross? You ponder on that?

    What's God's name! Yahweh! I don;t think so, It's Allah! Remember "Ela, Ela, lamasah-tani! (Hebrew/Aramiac)" Meaning "God, God, Why have you forsaken me!" does this sound like "Yahweh Yahweh lamasbah-tani!"? No it sounds like "Allah, Allah lamasabatch-tani (Arabic) . What was the name of God? Allah/Ellah - only difference in spelling, pronounciation is exactly the same.

    And "Ela Lu ya!" Christians shout this when they get emotionaly charged with holy spirit. In Arabic, "Allah Hu ya!" And the correct arabic reading is "Ya Allah hu!" Muslims say this when they praise God. So again what was the name o God? Allah, Allah, and not Yahweh. That is from your own bible.

    In response to this he deneid that these verses have ever existed, so in response to this I have sent this:

    I am quite surprised that you have never heard of these two phrases. The reason is that I have never met any Christian Unitarian or Trinitarian, who is not familiar with these two statements. Or perhaps in your Bible these two phrases have been translated, which is never the case. I have yet to come across a Bible that has these two phrases translated into English.

    Since my last visit, I have stumbled upon a very important word. Ellohim, is a Hebrew word meaning "The God". Now here is the crunchy bit, word Elloh (Allah) and the part "im", singnifies the plural form of word Allah, so literally it means "The Gods". Every Arabic, Hebrew, Aramiac, Urdu, Persian, Hindi etc, speaking person is aware of the fact that there are two types of plurals, plural of number, and plural of respect. and the word Ellohim (Allah-hum) is the plural of respect, and not number. And where ever in the Old Testament, you find God, its a really a translation of Word Ellohim, for obvious reasons. You may also be awre of the Queens English, meaning the words used by a person to reffer to himself, We, Us,Ourself, etc;

    Now with refferences:

    "Ela, Ela, lamasabatch-tani! (Mark:15:34/ Matthew 27:46/ Psalms 22:1).

    "Ela Lu ya!" "Hallelujah!" "Alleluia!"

    Possible Spelling difference -(Revalation 19:1- 7)

    Clear evidence that name of God is Allah and not Yahweh. Allah hu akbar! (Allah is the Greatest!)

    So what was the name of God? Allah, Allah, Allah!

    With reagrds to the rest of your message I will deal with it in my next response.

    Oh yeah! here is a response to the Moon God myth paper: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Sources/Allah/moongod.html he really is silly isn't he?

    Peace!

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers
    Oh yeah! here is a response to the Moon God myth paper: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Sources/Allah/moongod.html he really is silly isn't he?

    Not really because most Islamic resourses say the same. There are many Muslams that will admit that thier religion came from the Moon/God cult. So I guess your own people arew silly too by your standard. Also stop being like a JW and start thinking for yourself

    BTW I am a bible believing Christian (Reformed Calvinist Presbyterian)

    cheers,

    jr

  • Muslim
    Muslim
    Not really because most Islamic resourses say the same. There are many Muslams that will admit that thier religion came from the Moon/God cult. So I guess your own people arew silly too by your standard. Also stop being like a JW and start thinking for yourself

    Ha ha ha! why don't you start thinking for your se;lf and top telling me that I am not htinking cause I have proved my case that Bible is also preaching the same Allah, So prove e wrong if you know how to think.

    First of all, which muslim, and where are the many muslims, who beleive that Mood-god is Allah? Give me a refference from the muslims books or the muslim internet sites which states that muslims beleive in Allah the moon-god. I have read every kind of Islamic literture , but I have never read on which states that Allah is the moon God. I know you are lieing but see where your lieing gets you. Evidence please!

    And what are you going to do about the Allah in your Bible? should i say that he is the same Allah the moon god, i faat you should read the Mooreys book once agian, this tie read the page 12 and after, it says that the cananites israelites worshiped the moon good, to prove that he goes through alot of evidence.

    What about the Al-illah in you bible , Dr Moorey has proved conclusively that Israelites worshiped the moon god, but what remains to be proven that Arabs ever worshipping moon God.

    The debate i had ad with a missionary was posted here to make you rea.lise that you have the same Allah (not really Al-ilah) in your bible.

    YOu are a Calvanist, let me find a little about the evil cult, i remember reading soething about yout founder of the sect, Where did i read about Calvin?

    peace!

  • joannadandy
    joannadandy
    peace!

    How very very funny that you should spout hate and killing and end your posts with this phrase.

    How could Jesus hate jews? He was born of a jewish woman? You have given some lovely examples of how people twist words to fit whatever they want.

    Why are you here? Most people here do not care for the teachings of Islam and are more concerned with jw dogma...you are in the wrong venue if you want to discuss here.

  • Muslim
    Muslim
    How very very funny that you should spout hate and killing and end your posts with this phrase.
    My toonge say kill, kill kill, but the heart & soul say: enough of the blood shed, peace, peace, peace.

    Lady let me tell you why I write about killing the jews? YOu see when something hurts really bad, and it is effecting your life, the psyhologist advises that talk about your pain to someone that will help you to normalise.

    Let me give you example what the psyhologist is trying to prenvent from happening, he is actually stoping you from blowing up. Suppose you have a car, you take the car to the petrol pump and use the air pump to fill in the air in car's tyre. You press the botton and then wat you do? you make sure that the air pressure is not inreased too much otherwise the tyre will blow up, and if there is too muh air in the tyre you remove the air from the tyre until in is recomanded level. Same with me I listen to the news on bbc and every day I am told that Jews have killed two chilren and destroyed several houses and have captured over thirty men for intergation, (they never return home again) and etc;

    After few weeks of listening to this news I get to the stage of exploding just like the car tyre, and to stop my self from exploding I shout, swear, and even punch the bags and pillows to realse the pressure in side me. And If i was not doing this then I would have exploded in a jewsih resturant, Coffee, bus, or shop, killing alot more jews with my self.

    I come on the net I post this type of messages and people aask questions and which i an't ask my slf, I get to dig deep into my concise and answer your questions and sarasrtic remarks which is better then swearing and shouting, cause it really helps me to realise my human nature. It take few months for y anti-semetic beast to kick in. Then I get the urge to kill every single jew man woman children ,even those who have converted to islam, just for the reason that they where jews. To get rid of this evil urge I do all this. it helps me to be human.

    Let me state clealrly that I have never ment to harm any one, other then those who are responsible of causing death of the muslims. By that I mean the Israeli Army, no one else. I don't hate all the jews, I have compassion for those Jews who have been victims of the plastinain sucide bomber, those who have died has a result of this I pray to allah for there reward. I am a human not a beast! "Oh Allah grant me a portion of sabr (paitence), from your endless bounty."

    Peace!

  • joannadandy
    joannadandy

    Muslim-thank you for explaining that to me. I think alot of us came to this website to vent and discuss the Jehovahs Witness Organization that caused so many of us so much pain. In that regard I can sympathize with you. I don't share your world view perhaps, or religious convictions, but thank you for explaining it to me, and I hope if this really is your way of dealing, that you always continue to vent your frustrations in this type of venue rather than a violent action. Good luck to you.

  • Double Edge
    Double Edge

    oookkkkkeey...... uh.... yeah .... good luck ...... thanks for sharing

  • smiddy
    smiddy

    In veiw of the focus on muslims around the world today , and here in australia with recent events , I thought I would bump this thread .

    Also of interest is the list  "muslim" gives of the gospells that were around in the time of the apostle paul

    smiddy

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