by bound2fly2002 13 Replies latest watchtower bible
Hello,am new at this so bear with me please. I need any scriptures that any ex-witnesses can give to refute the idea of "knowledge leads to everlasting life". Need this ASAP before next meeting with them at my home. I will do my best always to help them see the errors, but I seek ex-witnesses with first hand knowledge for assistance in this matter.
Thank-you kindly
How about this one? It's John 5:39,40 from their own "New World Translation".
You are searching the Scriptures, because you think that by means of them you will have everlasting life, and these are the very ones that bear witness about me. And yet you do not want to come to me that you may have life."
So life would come from faith in Jesus, and not merely from knowing the scriptures !!
They often use the scripture "not to throw pearls before swine" in the sense of knowledge. Whether they use this correctly or not I don't know, but in doing so they acknowledge that simply thowing knowledge at someone like mud at a wall is not enough, something which is immediately apparent as an ex-witness. Make sure you're not doing the same thing.
any scripture that refers to Jesus as "Lord"
Witnesses cringe and avoid calling him the "Lord Jesus Christ".
If pushed, they will do so - but they avoid it in normal conversation
metatron
The problem is, bound2fly, you can discuss scriptures and counter-scriptures ad-infinitum. The bottom line is that the witnesses beliefs are built like a jigsaw, one piece locks into every other. I now consider it as brainwashing. Removing one piece is not good enough, becuase at the bottom of this house of cards, is the ultimate belief that they are the only true religion, and they represent the true God Jehovah, and they alone receive knowledge through his faithfull and discreet slave. When someone even starts to tamper with these basic beliefs, the witness leaves their 'comfort zone', they will feel uneasy, they will start to reject what you are saying almost
Welcome boundfly
Welcome Boundfly-
The truth of the matter is it is NOT Knowledge that leads to life it is KNOWING!!!!
John 17 :3 in their new World is wrong. It is" this means everlasting life their KNOWING."
Hey you can know all about me.but live with me & you Will KNOW!!!!!! me/
I had a lot of knowledge about Elvis, but talk to his ex......She KNOWS him
I took a lot of knowledge in about Jesus when I was a JW. But once I asked HIM to come into me ( 2nd Corth 13. 5,6) I now KNOW him He lives with me....( ducking from the stones of those who dont believe) but even though many may not believe on here they still love me. I know by there comments.... Except maybe IW......
But read another translation theirs is added & deleted ...in spots., (((hug)))
John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
BoundtoFly,
Use the very verse you are speaking of. The might know in this verse translated as taking in knowledge in the NWT in not something gained by study. It is in the present tense not some future tense as if it is something we gain later through effort. Strongs give meanings such as:
1097 ginwskw ginosko ghin-oce-ko
a prolonged form of a primary verb; TDNT-1:689,119; v
AV-know 196, perceive 9, understand 8, misc 10; 223
1) to learn to know, come to know, get a knowledge of perceive, feel
1a) to become known
2) to know, understand, perceive, have knowledge of
2a) to understand
2b) to know
3) Jewish idiom for sexual intercourse between a man and a woman
4) to become acquainted with, to know
In other words it means you know God you understand God and His will and God knows you. And you know Jesus Christ just as well as you know God, you already have this knowledge.
The truth sets us free from this kind of indoctrination. And if you know God then you know that the doctrine of the Watchtower does not come from Him. Therefore you can say to them.
Which one of the many books that they have printed can they hold up and say; This is the truth, there are no mistaken doctrines or biblical principles taught in it?
Hopefully they will answer none.
How many of your many books can the hold up and say; This is as close to the truth that we can come but there are many mistaken docrines in it
Hopefully they will answer all of them.
And even beyond doctrines, their practices and principles keep changing. How many such doctrines and practices are wrong at this very moment?
If they say none they are lying. They do not consider child abuse a legal matter to be reported to authorities first as in Romans chapter 13. Instead they try to keep them internal and hidden.
Questions such as this get to the point rather quickly. But if you try to correct such error in their thinking they will be gone, brand you as an evil person or tell some other lie to make you look bad. So it is your call. Handle it the best way you can. Joseph
Ironically, the very reason that the JWs are hell bent on "studying" the bible so much, with bible studies at home with 'new light' is because the truth is they don't know Him. " you search the scriptures but do not come to me " - and where is He? Well, the poor are blessed, broken and handed out - where do you think He is?
"and without Him was nothing made that Was made"
paduan
Great Posts and Scriptures by everyone!
Welcome to the Board bound2fly2002
Here are some more Scriptures you can use:
Isaiah 5:20: Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; Who put darkness for light, And light for darkness; Who put bitter for sweet, And sweet for bitter!
Isaiah 5:21: Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes, And prudent in their own sight!
Jeremiah 9:23: Thus says Yahweh [Jehovah], Don't let the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, don't let the rich man glory in his riches;
Jeremiah 9:24: but let him who glories glory in this, that he has understanding, and knows Me, that I am Yahweh [Jehovah] who exercises loving kindness, justice, and righteousness, in the Earth: for in these things I delight, says Yahweh [Jehovah].
1st Corinthians 3:18: Let no one deceive himself. If anyone thinks that he is wise among you in this world, let him become a fool, that he may become wise.
1st Corinthians 3:19: For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, "He has taken the wise in their craftiness."
1st Corinthians 3:20: And again, "The Lord knows the reasoning of the wise, that it is worthless."
1st Corinthians 3:21: Therefore let no one boast in men. For all things are yours
John 3:14: But even as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
John 3:15: so that whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16: For God so loved the world that He gave His Only-Begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 3:17: For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but so that the world might be saved through Him.
John 3:18: He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the Name of the Only-Begotten Son of God.
John 3:19: And this is the condemnation, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than the Light, because their deeds were evil.
John 3:20: For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light, lest his deeds should be exposed.
John 3:21: But he who practices truth comes to the Light so that his works may be revealed, that they exist, having been worked in God.
Matthew 9:11: And when the Pharisees saw, they said to His Disciples, Why does your Master eat with tax-collectors and sinners?
Matthew 9:12: But when Jesus heard, He said to them, The ones who are healthy do not need a physician, but the ones who are sick do.
Matthew 9:13: But go and learn what this is, I want mercy and not sacrifice. For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
1st Timothy 1:15: The saying is faithful and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1st Timothy 1:16: However, for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first, Jesus Christ might display all His patience, for an example of those who were going to believe in Him for eternal life.
Luke 7:50: He said to the woman, "Your Faith has saved you. Go in peace."
Ephesians 2:8: for by grace [undeserved kindness] you have been saved through Faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
Ephesians 2:9: not of works, that no one would boast.
Ephesians 2:10: For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared before that we would walk in them.
Romans 3:20: Because by the works of the Law, no flesh will be justified in His sight. For through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.
Romans 3:21: But now apart from the Law, a righteousness of God has been revealed, being testified by the Law and the Prophets; [the Old Testament]
Romans 3:22: even the righteousness of God through Faith in Jesus Christ to all and on all those who believe. For there is no distinction,
Romans 3:23: for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God;
Romans 3:24: being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus;
Romans 3:25: whom God set forth to be an Atoning Sacrifice, through Faith in His Blood, for a demonstration of His righteousness through the passing over of prior sins, in God's forbearance;
Romans 3:26: to demonstrate His righteousness at this present time; that He might Himself be Just, and the Justifier of him who has Faith in Jesus.
Romans 3:27: Where then is the boasting? It is excluded. By what manner of law? Of works? No, but by a Law of Faith.
Romans 3:28: We maintain therefore that a man is justified by Faith apart from the works of the Law.
