Can they change? CofC, and ? about ISPs

Brummie

I'm in the questioning mood so here goes:

1, Can paedophiles change for the better? If they change should we forgive them? what do you think? I was counselling a guy a while ago and eventually, after weeks of building a friendship, he confessed to having been a ped about 12 years previous(cringe), he is going back into the JWs after being dis'fd a few years ago for other things. It seems they are welcoming him with open arms and its convincing him to go back, he even goes to Tues book study! I was privately reproved for reading Rays book back in the late 80's and put on probabtion for 6 months (geeesh I missed microphone and car park privaleges) and I couldnt answer up in book study, another freind of mine wasnt even allowed to go to the book study but only the KH, yet here's a guy who is guilty of a hidious crime and yet is allowed to speak to other JWs and go to all the meetings! I no longer communicate with this guy, decided to call it a day when he came out with his confessions. Point is, he says he's recovered from his past lifestyle, should we believe him and forgive? Naturally we cant forgive him for the wrong he has done to someone else but should we forever hold him at arms length? Or try to view him as a changed person

2, Have heard of so many people who left the WT after reading Rays book CofC, yet I still couldnt leave after reading that and plenty of others, Randys "Thus saith" was extremely powerful but I was still unable to get out and let go of it completely, even carried on pioneering, I was pig thick to say the least. Anyone here still struggling even after reading these? Or was you able to leave straight away after reading something like this? I read these now and wonder how on earth I could have stayed a second more.

For those in UK....I got freeserve as my ISP and a lot of times keep loosing the connection and disconnecting after a few mins....grrrrrrrrrr...sometimes its fine and connects at 46 bps and stays on for 2 hours without interuption..but recently its been going as low as 9bps...whose your server and could you recommend anyone better that provides a good connection? Have checked every other troubleshooter and its got to be the server. We cant get broadband or DSL in my area...:(

Brummie

TweetieBird

In reply to question 1 - I'm not sure if a pedophile is capable of changing. In my limited reading on the subject, everything seems to indicate that they cannot, but I'm no expert.

For question 2 - I read both of Ray's books and knew that the organization was not the truth, but having so many friends and family in it, I kept going going for a couple of years pretending that nothing had changed. It was very difficult. I still attend meetings once in a blue moon to keep people off my back, but it's very difficult to sit there and listen when you don't believe it anymore. I do know 1 person that has read C of C and it didn't affect her at all, but she's the only one.

Can't help you with #3, I live in the US.

deddaisy

Brummie, the first question is deeper than I want to journey, and I'm not in the UK. But as for C of C

Anyone here still struggling even after reading these?

I know firsthand that two of my siblings both read C of C, and both are still JWs.

wednesday

Brummie, u say u were counseling this man. Are u a therapist? are u required to report this info he disclosed to u?I think select people can be helped. The child must always be protected first-but if the molester wants help, i think he should be given it. I feel like if a person has molested once and gets help and never does it again help should be given to them. There must be sanctions on this person, but perhaps they can be rehabilated. However, if a person molests more thatn once-they should throw the book at him and the full penalty under law.They should not ever get another chance.

Did u stop seeing this man due to his confession?What did u tell him to do? There are dedicated persons in the psychiatric world that will work with this element and try to help. If only this person could have been helped when they were a child-b/c frequenlty molesters have been molested themslefs as children and received no help. That is why it is so important to find out and help children of molestation as quickly as posssibe. Before they go on to molest another child.

I speak from personal experience-i was molested as a small child .For me it has resulted in years of depression and low self esteem and self hatred. Finally i received help and i am much better.

My father, the molester, never admitted it his entire life. I was so fearful of him i blocked it out until he was dying.My father was bipolar and drank. he was an angry man. He tried to help me a lot in my 20-i think in some sort of effort to make it up. I really feel for him it was a one time deal and i don't think he ever molested other children. but he would have never went to therapy. however, if i had remembered the molestation as a child, i probably would have reported him. But that was many years ago, rape and child abuse were not hot topics as they are now. probably no one would have believed me.

LB

I'm no expert but from what I've read they always have those urges. They can't be trusted again. Which makes Watchtower policy even more frightening.

stichione

I have read both C of C and In Search of.... In my situation I can't walk away much as I would like to, I have too much to loose. My whole family and all my friends are Dubs, and getting df'd or da'ing myself would be catastrophic to my family. Rest assured though that as a result of these books and others, including many websites, my faith has cooled considerably. I stopped making monthly reports and only attend Sunday meetings to keep the peace.

I can't now serve the Organization the way I used to since I now have come to the understanding that this religion is not better nor does it get special treatment than other Christian religion. I also realize that living the Dub Christian way I am being robbed of having a meaningful relationship with God and Jesus. But I'm trapped. I'm trapped.

willy_think

Well, you answered the forgive part your self, "We cannot". Should we keep him at arms length? Are you asking weather we should trust him with access to our kids because he said he wont do it again?

What is the risk/reword ratio if his "transformation"? If it is legitimate are kids gain nothing, if it is not, our kids louse too much to count. to me it seems like a no brainer.

Sometimes it's better to not role the dice.

If I misunderstood what you meant by "arms length" would you please clarify for me.

A Paduan

"every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men"

However, just as you don't give alcoholics free pub vouchers, being reappointed boy scout leader seems a bit appropriate - as does making a point of sending them to unsuspecting people's homes. They could go where the need is greater - adult spots only - the kingdom already belongs to children anyway.

As for a fuss of forgiveness, could just be that "my enemy's enemy is my friend" - but I'm synical, I'd be quicker to forgive the paedophile than the wts.

paduan

LovesDubs

I am of the opinion that pedophiles CANT stop having the urges. I can forgive someone who has done this, but I wont forget it ever. Its the most base and heinous crime against children, and if it was a person that I KNEW who was molested, I dont think I could EVER forgive the perp. They have forever altered the entire existence of their victims. I couldnt have anything to do with ANYBODY who ever did that...I wouldnt be able to think of anything else they ever did, no matter how good intentioned...after that.

As for getting out even with a plethora of AntiJW information stored between your cheeks...none of it matters if, as our brother just said, you are "trapped"..and trapped he is as are millions of others in there. Living in fear, living in dissonance in their souls.

Its Hotel California...you can check out, but you can never leave. Even tho I am "out" becuase my husband and his family are IN...there is no escaping it for the REST of my life.

Brummie

Thanks for your responses, appreciated. Willy_ good response, "Arms length" means keeping him at a distance, I would never let anyone near my kids who had such a record regardless of how long ago or how converted they claimed to be, I have trust issues i guess.

Wednesday, I am a Person Centred advanced counsellor (Carl Rogers type) undergoing more training to broaden the horizens. The guy has been convicted by police for his past crime and served time so I didnt need to persue that, however since I can relate to your past experience I didnt feel capable of dealing to much with his counselling need, I suggested he seek a more behavioural type of therapy such as pyschodynamic.

Have to go, work beckons (ugh)

Will get back to this thread later, thanks again to all

Brummie

Can they change? CofC, and ? about ISPs

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