Yahweh's wonderful creation

fulltimestudent

When I thought of myself as a Christian witness of Yahweh attempting to be a footstep follower of Jesus, Psalm 104 was one of my favourites. If I was ever in some wonderful scenic area, Psalm 104 would jump into my mind, and I'd start to praise Yahweh and Jesus.

But if something horrible came to mind as in the following video, I'd always think of the favourite Christian escape clause, it's all because of Adam's sin. But any connection between natural animal savagery and Adam's sin is never logically made in the Bible.

Interestingly, the supposedly inspired Psalm 104 (NWT-the grey one I guess) itself says that:

The young lions* roar for their prey And seek their food from God.+

So when you watch this, the Psalm says, its the way that Yahweh arranged things, the leopards/etc are eating their "food from God himself"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LolUsup1Mow

defender of truth

But if something horrible came to mind as in the following video, I'd always think of the favourite Christian escape clause, it's all because of Adam's sin.
But any connection between natural animal savagery and Adam's sin is never logically made in the Bible.

Great topic.

Natural animal savagery has been happening for millions of years, long before Adam existed, even if a person believes that he did exist at all.

Predation, even to the point of species becoming completely extinct, occurred well before the first sin was committed, before mankind existed even.

As you inferred, God's original Plan for his perfect creation must have involved a predator/prey arms race that has spanned, not just thousands, but millions of years.. How loving.

Here is an entire thread on the topic of animal suffering, for those who may have wondered why God allows animals to suffer:

www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/222352/theists-why-does-god-allow-suffering?size=10&page=1

[There is a great introductory/summary link, showing briefly how this topic relates to Jehovahs Witness' beliefs, posted on the last page, for any who don't have time to read over 700 interesting replies..]

Perry

But any connection between natural animal savagery and Adam's sin is never logically made in the Bible.

Here's some food for thought here.

cofty

An oxymoron (plural oxymora or oxymorons) is a figure of speech that juxtaposes elements that appear to be contradictory

e.g. "Christian Think Tank"

Village Idiot

Perry: "Here's some food for thought here."

Reminds me of Witness speculation on Genesis like the days of creation were 7,000 years long; baby dinosaurs were brought into Noah's ark (and then went extinct soon after); animals in Noah's ark hibernated; etc.

CalebInFloroda

@fulltimestudent

You actually have Jewish theology behind you.

In Judaism there is no doctrine of "Original Sin," and therefore none of the texts in the Hebrew Scriptures were written with this view in mind nor can be honestly read with this doctrine as an intention.

Of particular interest is that Psalm 104 is a creation hymn, and recited/chanted as a daily prayer in Judaism each morning. Because of its connection with origins or beginnings, it is also recorded on Rosh Chodesh (New Moon) and gets used similarly in the Divine Office/Liturgy of the Hours in both Orthodox Christianity and Catholicism as part of their official daily prayers too.

As such the Psalm is a poetic description of the natural circle of life that includes both life and death as normal facets of creation.

Introvert 2

As such the Psalm is a poetic description of the natural circle of life that includes both life and death as normal facets of creation.

Quite true CF, my take is that it's necessary for the life cycle / ecosystem to be self sustaining. The carcasses feed the bottom feeders and so on creating top soil all along the way through wastes. Think about it how else could it all hold together. Adam's sin does not have anything to do with some animals being meat eating killing machines, it's how they were designed and they seem to manage quite well with out us interfering. Of course I just pulled this out of my uneducated butt, but is my simple tradesman's slant.

defender of truth

Perry:

Genesis 2-3 show that humanity and animals existed in apparent cooperation and harmony at some point in the past, and that animals were in the Garden.
Humanity and the animals were apparently herbivorous at the time (but not necessarily exclusively so-- they might have eaten insects or even occasional meat, but the bible seems to indicate that they were mainly plant-eating at the time)

Yawn.

The page is not even attempting to discuss the question of why animal suffering and predation was part of a loving God's perfect plan.. BEFORE humanity was 'created' ?

It doesn't mention the predators from millions of years ago, before Adam.

Genesis 8 indicates that God was mindful of the animals ("God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark").

You mean after he had needlessly, and with premeditation, drowned almost all of the world's animal population in the Flood??

How lovely of him to be mindful of the relatively few survivors of his mass murder.. Some thinktank they are (!)

6. Somewhere in the Messianic Future, the ecosystem will return to the basic original blueprint of peaceful harmony and generalized herbivory (or a comparable plan).

Where is the evidence for this 'basic original blueprint of peace, harmony and generalized herbivory'? In the Bible?

defender of truth

All evidence indicates that ancient life was exactly as it is today - brutal, violent, painful, and short. This, Jehovah's Witnesses must believe, was the perfect creation of God.

www.jwbeliefs.com/jehovahs-witnesses-believe-animal-suffering-and-death/

prologos

Some thinktank they are (!)
defender of truth

Their thinking tanked.

Yahweh's wonderful creation

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