Theory of Evolution and humanity are moving in parallel, and in opposite direction too!

by iconoclastic 21 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • iconoclastic
    iconoclastic

    Proponents of evolution theory was comfortable with their easiest method of induction that says something like this: “I saw a blind man in the US, then in Russia, then in Australian, then in Africa ..., hence all men are blind.”

    Yet proofs are abundant for the decline (opposite of evolution) we experience globally!

    1) Most humans declined into greed, the result of which is climate change which has the potential to wipe out all life from the earth. July 2015 was the hottest month in recorded history.(http://www.cbsnews.com/news/july-2015-was-hottest-month-on-record-globally/) Global recession (another effect of greed) that started in 2008 is now all set to assume the size of a global tornado!

    2) Religions (from religare, “reunite”) declined into divisiveness!

    3) When people were told to sacrifice the beast called ego, they declined into the easier option of sacrificing a literal animal (followed by eating its flesh too)

    4) Human body too is on the reverse gear with deadly disease being on the increase (https://agenda.weforum.org/2013/09/how-to-stop-the-rise-of-deadly-new-diseases/)

    5) Bible correctly foretold a global moral decline (the very opposite of evolution) in 2 Timothy 3:1-5

    All the scientific achievements we have made so far is the result of various combinations we have tried with properties of various elements of nature, most of which came with their ill-effects too, thus neutralizing all the supposed benefits—hardly an evolution from good to better.

  • Billyblobber
    Billyblobber
    Evolution has nothing to do with making things "better," that's something stupid that's told to religious people by other religious people that didn't pay any attention in middle school biology. Your premise is wrong, thus, the post is kind of pointless.
  • StarTrekAngel
    StarTrekAngel

    True. Evolution is full of dead ends. Not everything evolves for the "better". At the end, survival is what shows if evolution adapted to the current situation.

    However, some of the points iconoclastic brings up, are the very reasons why I strongly believe in social evolution as well. In the animal kingdom, life is not respected the same way humans do. Survival of the fittest does not care about moral values in the animal kingdom. We humans are driven to save and conserve every life and we consider this idea to be of a higher order of thinking (I am not here to debate wether this is correct or not, is just a fact and I agree with preserving life). At the same time, we pretty much live in the same environment as the animals and therefore under some of the same rules. We have introduced some rules of our own, namely religion, finance, technology, etc. Some of the by products of the above, like global warming, deforestation, etc, have taken its toll on the planet much much faster than what is known to be common in evolutionary changes. In other words, we have introduced a ripple in the evolutionary order, bigger than any other drastic weather change on record. Social evolution has its effects on this as many of the above. Could this be one of the dead ends? May be, but I can not help and see how our social and moral values have contributed to the overall decisions made. This wasn't all driven by instinct. True, there is a degree of it, we are programmed to survive and as such, we will consume. But even in the animal kingdom some animals think twice about things. Some tarantulas protect a tiny race of frogs from predators because this frogs eat insects that would otherwise eat the tarantula's eggs. If that was the case for humans, in some cases we would have eaten the frog before we realized what kind of benefit it brought to us.

  • Billyblobber
    Billyblobber
    Our social evolution is also tied into evolution as social animals will often evolve in ways that are focused around group survival as a whole. Much of our morality is centered strictly around that.
  • Saintbertholdt
    Saintbertholdt
    1) Most humans declined into greed, the result of which is climate change which has the potential to wipe out all life from the earth. July 2015 was the hottest month in recorded history.(http://www.cbsnews.com/news/july-2015-was-hottest-month-on-record-globally/) Global recession (another effect of greed) that started in 2008 is now all set to assume the size of a global tornado!

    Humans have adapted to abundance, the result of which is short sighted greed. Regarding anthropomorphic climate change: Even if we manage to wipe ourselves out entirely, evolution will continue. We would be arrogant to think we can extinguish all life on earth. Its just humans who are going away if we are irresponsible. The planet itself is doing just fine.

    2) Religions (from religare, “reunite”) declined into divisiveness!

    Alvin Toffler predicted this in the 1960's. An information culture (Where everyone can speak to everyone) makes smaller and smaller sub groups (divisions) possible. For example: Christianity sub group:Protestants - sub group: Adventists sub group: Jehovah's Witnesses sub group: ex Jehovah's Witnesses etc. etc. etc. until in 2034 you end up with Homosexual ex-Jehovah's Witnesses who believe in the invisible parousia of Marvel's Thanos.

    3) When people were told to sacrifice the beast called ego, they declined into the easier option of sacrificing a literal animal (followed by eating its flesh too)

    I thought Yahweh insisted on a blood sacrifice?

    Also sacrifice of the ego leads to mindlessly dangerous people. See the Manson Family.

    4) Human body too is on the reverse gear with deadly disease being on the increase

    Two weeks ago it was announced that the Ebola vaccine is 100% effective in trials. Who knew?


    Notice a trend?

    5) Bible correctly foretold a global moral decline (the very opposite of evolution) in 2 Timothy 3:1-5

    Pick a human civilization or age and you will see the same characteristics of what 2 Timothy 3:1-5 is describing.

    The same generalized type of predictions you can get in any glossy magazine with an astrology page.



  • galaxie
    galaxie
    The evolutionary process has resulted in producing species which eventually became incompatible with the evolutionary environment . Evolution is not a process which results in producing good or better or bad or worse as a pre designed objective it is entirely driven by adapting to environmental circumstances for all life forms . Modern man has the ability to influence our environment positively or negatively, the evolutionary process continues regardless of the natural or unnatural environment and eventually all life on earth will adapt by evolution no matter how we in human terms define if it is in our terms parallel or opposing as such a definition would require us to believe that evolution has a definable pre conceived purpose. It is merely a process which is evidentially factual and which we undeniably live with no matter what spin we put on it.
  • StarTrekAngel
    StarTrekAngel

    Saint,

    1) Agree. Abundance was there for some but in many cases, the most precious bounty had to be chased and it could also attack you. It wasn't an easy life. This was ok while we were living in small groups. This does not work well when we have to feed millions. We quickly saw the benefit of raising and growing our own food. However, some noticed that they could manipulate other to feed them instead of having to hunt themselves. Look at some of the prescriptions for the priests of Israel. I am trying to keep this short but even in a culture of abundance, you still had to go up to the three and pick your own fruit.

    2) True, but I believe that his prediction has worked for the current situation. I am not sure if he made any further predictions, but could it be said that the same ability to communicate will eventually brings us back together? May be the collective human race is acting like when you meet a new friend. We are now at a stage of misunderstanding each other because this ability to communicate has just brought us together. May be this same ability will finally help us settle our differences and end up bringing us closer.

    3) Totall agree

    4) Is difficult at this stage to tell if decease is winning the battle. We may have won over many of them but we don't know the long term effects. A long time ago, the development of antibiotics was seen as a win. Today over prescription is seen as a lurking danger. Sure it was our fault, but it shows that we grow in waves, not always in a straight line upwards and it shows that what we consider an absolute success today, may not be that much after all and may need rethinking. Hopefully longer term adjustments are detected and made soon before it becomes and irreversible problem. We are living longer, but is also understood that in many places the morbidity (a measure of the quality of life) is severely declining towards the later part of life. People are getting chronic deceases earlier in life.

    5) My grandfather use to say how screwed up the world was getting and I could not understand what he was talking about. I am now beginning to have the same feeling but I can not help and see that, if he thought the world was bad in the 80's, that he would be totally outraged by the world of today. I also see from history that there are some things in which we have improved, in a way, not absolute. We don't sacrifice humans in an altar anymore, but we do sacrifice them in the name of other things by means of war and hunger. Could it by that here we also grow in waves?

  • punkofnice
    punkofnice
    Proponents of evolution theory was comfortable with their easiest method of induction that says something like this: “I saw a blind man in the US, then in Russia, then in Australian, then in Africa ..., hence all men are blind.”

    Sorry, Icon. I haven’t got a clue what you are getting at. What proponents? I think someone is making this up and conning you.

    Yet proofs are abundant for the decline (opposite of evolution) we experience globally!

    What decline? I think I’m missing the point here.

    1) Most humans declined into greed, the result of which is climate change which has the potential to wipe out all life from the earth. July 2015 was the hottest month in recorded history.(http://www.cbsnews.com/news/july-2015-was-hottest-month-on-record-globally/) Global recession (another effect of greed) that started in 2008 is now all set to assume the size of a global tornado!

    Why ‘most’ humans? What greed? This really does sound very JW-ish. A bifurcated view of life and people in it.

    2) Religions (from religare, “reunite”) declined into divisiveness!

    Sorry, I’m really lost now. Is it just me?

    3) When people were told to sacrifice the beast called ego, they declined into the easier option of sacrificing a literal animal (followed by eating its flesh too)

    Who was told to sacrifice ego, by whom and when? Where’s the evidence?

    4) Human body too is on the reverse gear with deadly disease being on the increase (https://agenda.weforum.org/2013/09/how-to-stop-the-rise-of-deadly-new-diseases/)

    That’s one observation. Another is that the human mind has overcome this through better medicines, increased knowledge and other things. Is the average lifespan less now than ever it was then? Again, this sounds very JW-ish.

    5) Bible correctly foretold a global moral decline (the very opposite of evolution) in 2 Timothy 3:1-5

    Decline and evolution. Is this non sequitur hour?

    All the scientific achievements we have made so far is the result of various combinations we have tried with properties of various elements of nature, most of which came with their ill-effects too, thus neutralizing all the supposed benefits—hardly an evolution from good to better.

    What are you on about? Are there examples you can provide please?

    I see some sweeping generalisations here. I think you might be falling into the Brahma Kumaris trap…beware my friend. You sound like you’re being conned by semantics and nonsense dressed up to sound intellectual.

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot
  • Saintbertholdt
    Saintbertholdt

    Hi Angel,

    1... This was ok while we were living in small groups. This does not work well when we have to feed millions. We quickly saw the benefit of raising and growing our own food. However, some noticed that they could manipulate other to feed them instead of having to hunt themselves.

    Life was exceptionally hard in past ages and so greed was essential. But I was actually just referring to what has been happening since the middle of the 20th century up until now. Food abundance is increasing due to the 'Green revolution'. When I refer to greed I am specifically referring to over abundance in developed countries (although increases are even happening in developing countries). Anthropomorphic climate change is green house gas driven which is by far caused by the west which is due to an over demand of everything (due to our evolutionary heritage which does not know how to deal with abundance). Which I don't even think is particularly wrong as long as you pay the true value of a product. For example: Pumping out spring water at cents a kiloliter to make a carbonated beverage does not mean that the actual value of the spring water is just cents a kiloliter. We are getting luxury products at a vastly discounted price which means we are borrowing from the future.

    2) True, but I believe that his prediction has worked for the current situation. I am not sure if he made any further predictions, but could it be said that the same ability to communicate will eventually brings us back together? May be the collective human race is acting like when you meet a new friend. We are now at a stage of misunderstanding each other because this ability to communicate has just brought us together. May be this same ability will finally help us settle our differences and end up bringing us closer.

    I think it just means we get to shop for the groups we belong to and we can pick more specific groups over time. For example: In the 1980's JW apostates were pretty much isolated and today here we all are on the internet. Never before have apostates and ex-JW's had the opportunity to mingle so freely because communication barriers have been removed. That's the gist of Tofflers thesis (as you probably know): What happens when we can all talk to each other? And that's the future. For example: I suspect as the forum grows new sub groups will be formed in the future. We will still may be a part of the bigger ex-JW community but would split off into our smaller groups in general. The ex-JW community already has a major division: Religious ex-JW's and atheist/agnostic ex-JW's. The battle lines are already drawn :) Oh and Toffler has a final prediction: Everything is going to be ok. (Your last comment on point 2)

    4) Is difficult at this stage to tell if decease is winning the battle. We may have won over many of them but we don't know the long term effects.

    I think humanity has a chance of beating devastating infectious disease. For example: Polio. The only reason polio still exists in developing countries is because (as you know) vaccination is a plot by the US to make their children sterile. Thus social intervention and not technology is mostly the barrier.

    Another quick stat:


    5) My grandfather use to say how screwed up the world was getting and I could not understand what he was talking about. I am now beginning to have the same feeling but I can not help and see that, if he thought the world was bad in the 80's, that he would be totally outraged by the world of today. I also see from history that there are some things in which we have improved, in a way, not absolute. We don't sacrifice humans in an altar anymore, but we do sacrifice them in the name of other things by means of war and hunger. Could it by that here we also grow in waves?

    Yep yep. These kids with their new fangled phones and face tubes. Their noses always in the things and you can't even have a conversation without them peeping at their little screens. In my day I could still understand music. Songs had a beat and a tune and lyrics. Nowadays its just wub wub wub, wheeeeeeee, haaaaaaaaaaa and a smurf singing backwards. Oh and how do you feed a horse in Minecraft? What the hell is a minecraft?

    "Could it by that here we also grow in waves?"

    Possibly. Whats the fourth wave I wonder?

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