Okay...just why is the "ransom" so gr...

by logansrun 37 Replies latest jw friends

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  Will Power

  Hi funky d

  There a couple of scenerios

  1. There is a God who by design created the capacity for humans to develop this free gift of - for lack of better words "spiritual bliss". Using the free will, creativity, intelligence etc. we humans enjoy - to start the journey to fullfilment.

  2. We are one big huge evolved organism with all the intricate workings, including temporal lobe activity that let us experience a state of mind full of contentment, satisfaction, euphoria at a level even greater than your best orgasm.

  The ones who experience this and tell about it inevitably get asked the question.... how did you get there? Visions, experiences etc whether God induced or merely a biological chain reaction have been handed down since time began. This was science back then. There are always leaders and followers. "I'll have what she's having" LOL

  So.... why do you choose to believe that it's more?

  The idea of God was my "tutor". Can people love others and themselves in an unselfish way without God? Sure. There are Zen Masters, Medicine men, clerics of all kinds. There is plenty of evidence of people who experience incredible life outside of life - our daily routines. I hear you can also use heroin.

  For me tho, I use God to "get me there". It makes my life today that much more meaningful and full of discovery.

  So in the end, either way, if I don't see ya, will we know which scenario was right?

  Use it or loose it - however it got there! Thats my motto. but stay away from the heroin, thats cheating.

  Thanks for the reply, I hardly ever get one

  Will
• 

  Francois

  6/9 - Well no, I'm not "making it all up" as you want to believe. See? You believe in something; you believe I'm "making this up." Actually not. And I do appreciate your evaluation that I have a "way with words." However I'm using them only to describe what I have experienced.

  It is an old Taoist statement that those who know do not say, and those who say do not know. Its meaning is that there is no way to describe how to contact the indwelling spirit, or what that's like, to someone who hasn't done it. A million words would not suffice. However, to someone who has had that sublime experience, no words are necessary.

  I hope you won't let your anger and hurt at what organized religion has done to you keep you permanently disaffected from the real experience of the spirit that you can have of yourself and by yourself and through yourself - all alone. No churches need apply, nor are they needed.

  francois
• 

  Will Power

  Francois

  I couldn't help but notice that you & I have similar views. You might not think so but it is hard to put beliefs into words.

  One thing about the transubstination (whatever that word is) It is a TOOL. to teach infants the idea of the spirit within. The reinforcement of symbolicly feeding the spirit within, keeps the memory that it exists alive. The pharasies made a mess of symbols, and there are people today who still only see things superficially. Superficial people/religions will always attack, dwelling on details. They have no spirit within.
  

  Its meaning is that there is no way to describe how to contact the indwelling spirit, or what that's like, to someone who hasn't done it. A million words would not suffice. However, to someone who has had that sublime experience, no words are necessary.

  Eloquently said.

  Will
• 

  SixofNine

  I hope you won't let your anger and hurt at what organized religion has done to you keep you permanently disaffected from the real experience of the spirit that you can have of yourself and by yourself and through yourself

  I aint sayin'
• 

  Francois

  You don't need to "say" . I'm with you in that I've been where you've been. And really when you think about it, how can anyone know where you're comin' from, 'less they been where you been, you see where I'm at?

  It is axiomatic, I fear, that organized religions have made off with some of the language of the spirit and so when others use it, like myself, it sounds like affectation. I try to avoid them whenever possible. However when you've got a religionist and a spirit-led person describing the same thing, it's only natural that their descriptive languages are going to collide. Not much I can do about that.

  But I can assure you this: you cannot find the spirit within following the roadmap demanded of you by any church, esp the JWs. It's obvious they don't know how themselves. The only way to find it is by first sincerely wanting to, and then looking where you've been told by the Carpenter (like that better?) it is to be found, i.e. within. And it also takes a form of dedication you wouldn't believe. Well, I guess you would believe it. I'm just saying it ain't easy, which is why it is said that narrow is the path....

  And narrow it may be, but I assure you that it is sufficiently wide for ALL who wish to enter.

  Ever seen the remake of "The Razor's Edge" with Bill Murray, Catherine Hicks, etc.? It's as good a place to start as any. Although "Jonathan Livingston Seagull" is transcendant, esp. with its Neil Diamond soundtrack.

  Will you watch one or the other and let me know what you think? I'd be grateful.

  francois
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  VeniceIT

  Good god I hope you don't belive in that Francois!!!!! hahaha

  Ven
• 

  crownboy

  VencieIT, what exactly do you believe on the topic, if I may ask? From what I recall of past posts from you, I thought you were a bible believing Christain. So welcome to the dark side, BTW .

  I think AlanF's post pretty much covers my thinking on it. If god's in charge, he sets the rules. If his rules are absurd, so is he. The ransom scenario is absurd.
• 

  plmkrzy

  Hi Francois

  The former Passover celebration commemorated the emergence of the Jews fathers from a state of racial slavery into individual freedom and joy. Now The Master was instituting a new remembrance supper as a symbol of the new dispensation wherein the enslaved individual emerges from the bondage of ceremonialism and selfishness and ecclesiastical authority

  The "purpose" of the supper was made obvious and the "remembrance" of the occasion was clearly made by Jesus at that time, he also declared that one of his disciples would rat him out before the night was over. What was that all about, if Jesus was not referring to his death?

  If I follow what you are saying, you are suggesting that Jesus did not know he was going to be tried and sentenced to death? Then what was the purpose of the simbolizim "HE" used during the Supper?

  plum