Reading the book of Enoch found some gems.

by Crazyguy 11 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Crazyguy

  First off the book of Enoch or at least some of it's writings we're found among the dead sea scrolls. This to me proves that this book was as important to the Jews back then as any other. In the book a few things I noticed. First it talks about Watcher's which is the name used in the older Sumerian texts to describe the Annanaki. These are the lessor gods later known as angels that some came down and mated with woman. This word along with a couple of other things makes me think that the book of Enoch is a copy of a much older writing. Another reason is all the angels listed have names ending with El, like Michael etc. This book also talks about Michael a lot and he is the head of the good angels 4 good angels are all that is pretty much talked about on the good side. The bad angels number 200 ,these are the ones that come down and mated with woman etc.

  The phrase Son of man is used a lot and it's become clear to me that this phrase may have originated from this text. The Son of man is clearly a god in this book, possibly one just below the head God. The description of the top God, lord of spirits etc again is clearly from Sumerian origins. The biggest revelation to me while reading these writings is that it's become clear that the book of Revelations is a rework of this writing, the similarities are at times uncanny. Enoch is being shown around by an angel sees visions etc., just like john. Some of the descriptions about what's going on are also very similar.

  Just thought I would share and I believe that all or most of the writings in the Bible are texts copied or stolen from.Canaanite, Sumerian, Assyrian, Babylonian, and Egyptian writings then tweeked for Jewish consuption. This looks to be another example. I also believe that several different gods are talked about in these texts and then the texts we're redacted so as to then use just one, the Jewish one. Oh just one last note it's become clear to me that Jesus was never Michael or should I say never ment to be Michael. The Son of man and Michael are two entirely different beings in this text.
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  freemindfade

  I've always found this text interesting as well.

  This to me proves that this book was as important to the Jews back then as any other.

  This plus the book of Enoch is quoted in the bible book of James.
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  fulltimestudent

  Crazyguy : First off the book of Enoch or at least some of it's writings we're found among the dead sea scrolls.

  I agree its an important reference for us today. But its mere presence among the DDS found at Qumran need not prove that it was considered important. We need to understand why they may have considered it important.

  freemindfade : I've always found this text interesting as well. This plus the book of Enoch is quoted in the bible book of James.

  I went looking for the James reference, and couldn't find one. Would you mind posting it?

  
  

  It also occurred to me that perhaps you may have meant Jesus' other brother Jude?

  
  

  Its accepted by some that Jude was quoting the Enoch document,

  Jude 1:14-15, quoting Enoch 1:9 {2:1} [1]
  "And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
  "To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches, which ungodly sinners have spoken against him."

  
  

  
  
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  Lieu

  Ancient peoples had similar beliefs because it's been proven that humans spread out from one main region. Of course, they simply took those beliefs with them as they spread out ... no matter the language, it doesn't make one groups beliefs any older than another. The beginning of it is the same.

  What's different is which group developed script to write it down first.
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  Lieu

  These missing or omitted texts make me wonder.

  1. At the writing of revelation, Christians are on the run AWAY from Roman territories. The 7 congregations mentioned are all in what's now Turkey.

  2. How the hell does the supposed 'Bishops' all end up waltzing around Rome itself to vote on what's going to be Bible canon, while everyone is still on the run???

  3. Missing texts are missing because those who chose had no business choosing. It seems they were neither Jews nor Christians.

  Another good book mentioned in a question to Jesus is Tobit. (The lady with the 7 husbands). Without basic knowledge of it, you have no idea why they pose such a question.
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  fulltimestudent

  There is also a claim that Jesus quoted from the Book of Enoch. That is I think, a bit of a stretch, the use of similar wording does not necessarily mean a direct quote, and then again, if Jesus is quoted accuratedly it may just means that both Jesus and the author of the Enoch document had read (or, heard of) some other document that is now lost. For what its worth here's a list of claimed usage.

  Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth. (Mat 5:5) The elect shall possess light, joy and peace, and they shall inherit the earth. (Enoch 5:7 {6:9})
  
  the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the son (John 5:22). the principal part of the judgment was assigned to him, the Son of man. (Enoch 69:27 {68:39})
  
  shall inherit everlasting life (Mat. 19:29) those who will inherit eternal life (Enoch 40:9 {40:9})
  
  "Wo unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. (Luke 6:24) Woe to you who are rich, for in your riches have you trusted; but from your riches you shall be removed. (Enoch 94:8 {93:7}).
  
  Ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Mat. 19:28) I will place each of them on a throne of glory (Enoch 108:12 {105:26})
  
  Woe unto that man through whom the Son of man is betrayed! It had been good for that man if he had not been born. (Mat. 26:24) Where will the habitation of sinners be . . . who have rejected the Lord of spirits. It would have been better for them, had they never been born. (Enoch 38:2 {38:2})
  
  between us and you there is a great gulf fixed. (Luke 16:26) by a chasm . . . [are] their souls are separated (Enoch 22: 9,11{22:10,12})
  
  In my Father's house are many mansions (John 14:2) In that day shall the Elect One sit upon a throne of glory, and shall choose their conditions and countless habitations. (Enoch 45:3 {45:3})
  
  that ye may be called the children of light (John 12:36) the good from the generation of light (Enoch 108:11 {105: 25})
  
  the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. (John 4:14) all the thirsty drank, and were filled with wisdom, having their habitation with the righteous, the elect, and the holy. (Enoch 48:1 {48:1})
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  fulltimestudent

  Lieu : These missing or omitted texts make me wonder.
  1. At the writing of revelation, Christians are on the run AWAY from Roman territories. The 7 congregations mentioned are all in what's now Turkey.

  This map may help you to picture the Roman empire about the end of the 3rd Century CE.

  

  
  

  After Constantine became Emperor, he built a new capital for the Empire and named it Constantinople. It was renamed by the Ottomans when they captured the city as Istanbul.

  As can be seen on this next map. Nicaea is not so far from Constantinople.

  
  

  
  

  The Orthodox (eastern) churches make more fuss over the first council of Nicea that Protestant churches. This Othodox religious icon glorifies the council

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  And also in that part of the empire (and also part of modern Turkey) are the seven churches of Revelation.

  
  

  
  

  Its good you're wondering about it all!
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  Quarterback

  Thanks Fulltime Student. I enjoyed at those maps. I found them interesting.

  I'm not sure if the current version of the book of Enoch is the actual version that Jude spoke about.

  The scripture speaks about Michael being an Arc Angel. Jesus was described in having an Arc Angel's voice. It makes sense to think of Jesus being Michael.
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  freemindfade

  Yes Jude not James, sorry for the confusion.
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  Lieu

  Nice maps, thanks!