Have any JWs ever been on this site for a serious religious debate? (page 2)

MOLHIE-NIGG

JGNAT: dont cry i have not forgotten you!!!!!....i will answer you as well just so you dont feel left out..ok?

jgnat

Goodie! A real live debate. Ground rules? How about:

For the sake of this debate, we will use the Bible as our starting point.
No cut-and-paste from the Aid to Bible Understanding.
No bait-and-switch tactics. We will stick to the original topic until it runs it's course.
To the best of our ability, we will answer every question posed.
No name calling.

StinkyPantz

Molhie said:

Jws do not claim to be gods prophet

Oh really, explain these statements:

Watchtower 1972 April 1:

This "prophet" was not one man, but was a body of men and women . It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah's Christian witnesses ...

Awake! 1986 June 8:

You will be interested to learn that God has on earth a people, all of whom are prophets , or witnesses for God. In fact, they are known throughout the world as Jehovah's Witnesses.

Watchtower 1959 January 15:

Whom has God actually used as his prophet?

By the historical facts of the case Christendom is beaten back in defeat. Jehovah's Witnesses are deeply grateful today that the plain facts show that God has been pleased to use them. ... It has been because Jehovah thrust out his hand of power and touched their lips and put his words in their mouths...

Watchtower 1964 October 1:

... for God has on earth today a prophetlike organization , ... Jehovah's anointed witnesses on earth.

StinkyPantz

JGnat

I accept these rules. Does Mohlie?

ARoarer

Mohie-Nigg, Wecome. Why does the Watchtower teach that the "glorious ones" in the book of Jude are elders, when, clearly glorious ones is refering to angels? By changing the true meaning of who the glorious ones are is going against Revelation's warning about adding of taking away from the written word. By teaching that elders are "glorious ones" they are teaching false doctrines and speaking abusively angels.

onacruse

Hi jgnat! It wasn't a radio show debate, it was supposed to be an e-zine journal...administrative changes; honestly, I don't know what happened. I did part 1, but frankly, I lost interest in being a pseudo-JW devil's advocate against the Trinity. Insofar as I believe in the Bible, I believe that the Trinity is the most consistent theological position.

Emphasis: insofar as I believe in the Bible. My perspective on inspiration of the Bible has changed considerably. At this point, I believe that certain parts of the Bible may be inspired..as well as parts of other "sacred" writings on this planet.

Craig

amiable

Well, I see that people seem willing, anyway.

Looking up some of older posts that were referenced, I think that it doesn't look like a fair format. I get the impression that mohlie in this case will be outnumbered and the multitude will trounce with a bunch of stuff that he doesn't have time to answer, and then declare a victory.

For a real debate in this format you'd need new ground rules, as was suggested. You need to probably pit only two spokesman at a time and all help and supporting material brought out by others can be used by the debaters (or ignored) as they wish. (But all the extra posts are not actually part of the debate.) There should also be a mediator who scores the answers for how well they meet rules of rational thought or possible Biblical support. Finding an unbiased mediator could be a bigger problem here.

There should also be a commitment to the seriousness of the debate. No name-calling, attacking the person, etc. And a time limit. Perhaps it wasn't fair of springing this on mohlie. He might have felt he was the only one here at the time representing his beliefs. Also, it looks like some of these arguments become pro and anti-Bible instead of pro and anti-JW. I like the ground rules that were recommended.

Maybe mohlie wants a practice round to see how it goes. But the ex-JW side should decide which question goes out first, and then mohlie could decide which question goes out next. People who just want to join in and say how stupid anyone is who believes in a differing viewpoint should stay out.

I'm not suggesting this is the thread or even the forum, but maybe it would be a good idea to attract more JW firepower here, too. Seems a bit unbalanced at the moment. Maybe that's just natural for the Internet?

amiable

DanTheMan

I get the impression that mohlie in this case will be outnumbered and the multitude will trounce with a bunch of stuff that he doesn't have time to answer, and then declare a victory.

trounced with a bunch of stuff? Stuff, like, say, facts?

For a real debate in this format you'd need new ground rules, as was suggested. You need to probably pit only two spokesman at a time and all help and supporting material brought out by others can be used by the debaters (or ignored) as they wish. (But all the extra posts are not actually part of the debate.) There should also be a mediator who scores the answers for how well they meet rules of rational thought or possible Biblical support. Finding an unbiased mediator could be a bigger problem here.

Ignoring the facts presented doesn't seem to be a big problem for JW's who come here trying to defend the org. As far as meeting the rules of rational thought, let the readers discern. We're grown ups here.

There should also be a commitment to the seriousness of the debate. No name-calling, attacking the person, etc. And a time limit. Perhaps it wasn't fair of springing this on mohlie. He might have felt he was the only one here at the time representing his beliefs

From all of my experience on this board, it is always the JW who resorts to name-calling, sarcasm, insults, etc.

How is it unfair for Molhie? He quickly volunteered did he not?

Also, it looks like some of these arguments become pro and anti-Bible instead of pro and anti-JW

So you recognize there is a difference? lol

Maybe mohlie wants a practice round to see how it goes. But the ex-JW side should decide which question goes out first, and then mohlie could decide which question goes out next. People who just want to join in and say how stupid anyone is who believes in a differing viewpoint should stay out.

I dunno amiable. I'd suggest at this point that you head back to the KH. Sounds like you may not be ready yet. It is devastating to learn the truth about the truth.

amiable

I was just throwing out ideas to try to make it seem more fair. If both sides think it's fair, it's more likely to last a little bit longer. That's where I think the fun would be.

I don't believe I said which side I was on. I'd like to stay neutral in case there we do need a debate scorer, moderator, mediator or whatever you want to call it. But maybe you're right. We don't need it, "we're all grownups, here."

I kind of had my doubts that Molhie (sorry about my previous spellings) would even come back. I can't even tell if he's/she's serious. By throwing a lot of "stuff" at him, I mean facts and questions and insults and comments and pictures. But from his other thread comments #16, #17 etc, I don't even know if he's a JW. I think the JWs should look for a serious champion, like a David to meet Goliath, or a Goliath to meet David.

The way I see it, JWs could say "we should always be ready to give an answer to those who ask about the hope within us", or say we "stay away from fruitless debates." There would be scriptural grounds for both positions. But if a non-serious JW offers to debate and makes JWs look silly (in a "practice" round), then I'd hope another more serious contender would step up and we could all watch the fun.

amiable

FlowerPower

Great arguments Stinkypantz, and right from the horse's mouth, their own publications, especially those taken from the WT magazine, their main source for expounding "new light". Am anxious to see what Molhie has to say in rebuttal, to be fair I will not add any thing more(youv'e said a mouthful) and see if Molhie is able to refute what has clearly been printed by the WTBS. Flower

Have any JWs ever been on this site for a serious religious debate?

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