Mandated Shunning is a Crime

by Lee Marsh 125 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Lee Marsh

  What we do know is there there is a very high incidence of people who commit suicide after being disfellowshipped.

  At a Meetup group I am in, a few years ago we had about 9 people in the group. Someone asked how many of us seriously thought about suicide after they were disfellowshipped. Every single person put their hand up. Every one!

  A few of them tried. They were glad they were still alive. We were glad they were still alive.

  But we have all read the stories of people who do commit suicide or the family covers up that it was a suicide. They will say it was because the person felt so guilty for what they did. But they would never admit that it was the harshness of the shunning policy.

  Everyone in that group felt like they lost everything. Every person they knew. Their entire way of life. Their entire belief system. Their God. In one moment, everything gone.

  I know I felt it. Everyone in that group felt it. My sister felt it and tried many times before she finally succeeded.

  Over the last 24 years of listening to ex-JWs countless people felt the same way.

  The numbers may have been higher before the internet became a safe place to fall.

  But the reality is that when you are immediately treated like the walking dead, it isn't a long step to thinking you might as well be dead.

  That is what the shunning policy does to people. How many of us needed therapy to deal with this traumatic hole in our lives?

  How many people have to die?
• 

  NotFormer

  jhine11": If the WT were persuaded to change its tune and find new light then shunning could be stopped"

  They still claim that they don't punish people for choosing to have blood transfusions. If they lie about that, then they'll lie about shunning. They'll officially "change" the policy so that governments think they have, but they'll have an unofficial "soft shunning" policy that works effectively the same way. The JWs will know who to shun and why, they just won't admit it.
• 

  NotFormer

  Lee: How many people have to die?

  Hypothetical: every government in the world passes a law that says "Mandatory shunning is a crime" tomorrow. Do you really think a single life will be saved? The Dubs will still shun, the Amish will still shun, the Brethren will still shun. They'll just be cleverer about it. And people will keep dying.
• 

  NotFormer

  Not that I don't think it's worth trying to save those people. Trying to help them form networks outside of their abusive high control group could be more effective than trying to use the heavy hand of government. But they assume that any outsiders are mentally diseased and part of Satan's organisation. It's clever how self-protecting the whole degenerate and perverted JW system is. There are no easy answers. 😞
• 

  Lee Marsh

  DrearyWeather

  There is an untold number of disfellowshipped ones who have returned to JW's and have been the vocal promoters of this policy, given interviews in assemblies and conventions.

  Are you not aware that every word on the program is scripted? Even when I was in they doctored every word to make it sound like it was coming from me when really it was what they wanted people hear. That was in the early 80s and I know they have gotten even stricter since then.

  And really, what is a person supposed to say. "oh I missed my family so much because of the shunning I had to come back so they would talk to me again."

  No they say they were sorry and missed serving Jehovah. They found out how bad and wicked the world was and realized there is only safety in Jehovah's Organization. They say what they are told to say and forced to leave out what no one should really hear.

  I was so upset the first time they forced me to say things on the platform that weren't exactly true in my words. Nope not good enough. it had to be in their words. And it never changed.
  
  
• 

  Lee Marsh

  NotFormer15 hours agoLee: How many people have to die?
  Hypothetical: every government in the world passes a law that says "Mandatory shunning is a crime" tomorrow. Do you really think a single life will be saved? The Dubs will still shun, the Amish will still shun, the Brethren will still shun. They'll just be cleverer about it. And people will keep dying.

  Even if it saves one life it would be worth it.

  Or prevents one person from joining.

  Or helps one person out.

  Or stops one person from going back in
• 

  Ding

  The GB won't allow JWs to improvise.

  Independent thinking is dangerous to the borg.
  
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @Lee:

  I don't dispute the tragedy of suicide, but thats not the question. When someone says:

  How many people have to die?

  And

  Even if it saves one life it would be worth it.

  Then you are playing with a legal principle that basically allows you to legislate away any right. Do you know how many people die from car accidents? Each one of those lives is a family decimated by tragedy. We could ban cars. If nobody is driving we could save many lives. If it saves just one life, it's worth it. How many people need to die before we act?!

  The same logic (flawed) was applied to COVID lock downs. If it saves just one life, it's worth it.

  No it's not because there was never a proper consideration of the net effects.

  Shunning should not be a crime.
• 

  EasyPrompt

  Shunning in and of itself is a personal decision. The "crime" is that a group of men who fraudulently claim to represent God dictate who is "shun-worthy" to their misinformed followers. The GB of the CCJW do not follow what is written in the scriptures. They do not have authority from God to execute group ostracism judgments that according to the Bible should be personal decisions of individual Christians.

  
  

  If the corporate structure of the JWBorg was taken down, then the disfellowshipping doctrine of the WTBT$ would end. There would be no centralized structure holding records of disfellowshipped individuals, no Bethel Service Department enforcing and encouraging bans, no Pharisaical writing group making up extra unscriptural rules. The ungodly authoritarian structure behind the enforcement of the disfellowshipping doctrine would be gone. People in local congregations would have to make up their own minds as to who they want to hang out with and who they want to shun independently of any corporate structure, which is the way the Bible is written anyway, with respect for the consciences of individual Christians to make up their own minds on who they will associate with.

  
  

  The current governments express the desire to protect religious freedoms, not religious frauds. The fraudulence of the WTBT$ claiming to be Christ's judges has gone on long enough.

  
  

  
  
  

  https://archive.org/details/studiesinscriptu06russ/page/418/mode/1up
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  If the corporate structure of the JWBorg was taken down, then the disfellowshipping doctrine of the WTBT$ would end.

  The theme of this thread, or at least my comments in it, might be summarized as "please look at the net long-term consequences of what you propose". If only we could take down their corporate structure... oh is that all? Why didn't we think of that before?

  Maybe if we just got the government to seize all the WT property, drag the members, including the GB out into the streets and shoot them one at a time, declaring anyone who shuns their family will end up like this, that would stop this horrible tragedy.

  That could have any long term negative effects, right?

  The current governments express the desire to protect religious freedoms, not religious frauds. The fraudulence of the WTBT$ claiming to be Christ's judges has gone on long enough.

  Every religion thinks the other religions are frauds. Good forking lord!

  *bows head*

  Oh Lord, Thor, Zeus, or even the all mighty Eru Iluvatar, please grant these posters the ability to see more than one layer of cause and effect. Please I beg you!