Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus 19 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Ireneus

  When the world shuns JWs because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of Satan.
  

  When JWs shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.

  Such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings. JWs shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the Bible or Christian traditions:

  1)Cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—Galatians 5:17, 19, 25

  2)They removed Biblical portion that says Jesus told the prostitute 'sin no more' (John 8:1-11)

  3) They declare Veronica as a mythical character. In fact Veronica is more than reality as there were “many woman” who displayed the spirit of Veronica (Mathew 27:55) Veronica was moved with sympathy when she saw Jesus carrying his cross to Golgotha and gave him her veil that he might wipe his forehead. Veronica, from Latin vera(true) and Greek eikon (image) was a symbol of "Truth Icon" because she was not around Jesus during his triumphs and victories, or to benefit from his supernatural abilities, but appeared when Jesus was too tired, in real need of some help, which is the very essence of spirituality/Christianity (Mathew 5:44-48)

  4)They also got something no one would get from the Bible (Proverbs 27:11) where they find that it is God of the Universe who is begging help from his fallen/weak children so that God Almighty may be empowered to give an answer to the taunt of Satan.
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  cofty

  God of the Universe who is begging help from his fallen/weak children so that God Almighty may be empowered to give an answer to the taunt of Satan

  That would be a pathetic excuse for a deity. Personally I would have just told Satan to fuck off.
  
  
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  cobweb

  John 8:1-11 is a powerful story. Unfortunately, from what i understand, it isn't in the earliest manuscripts and most scholars believe it to be a later addition.

  Whilst the original gospels included made up stories by people who never knew Jesus a generation after he died, this made up story seems to have been put in at a later stage, thereby somehow making it dubious.

  Personally i think it is a highly resonant passage with positive implications and deserves to be followed more than much of the so called original material.
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  smiddy3

  God of the Universe who is begging help from his fallen/weak children so that God Almighty may be empowered to give an answer to the taunt of Satan.

  That does not sound like an Almighty GOD the Creator of the Universe to me.! More like a weak insecure being seeking validation from a failed human experiment that he tried .and is now appealing to them to get him out of the mess he created ?
  
  
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  venus

  cobweb,

  I too share your view which you put it very beautifully: "Personally i think it is a highly resonant passage with positive implications and deserves to be followed more than much of the so called original material."

  Since stories are the reflection of the time in which it is written, thus real as the history, there is no reason why any story should be shunned if it contains a moral. If I were to rate, I would say John 8:1-11 is the best of all the Bible stories because it contains multiple lessons such as:

  --Examine yourself before you accuse another,

  --What is next is what matters, not what has happened in the past

  --Humans have the power over their body--if they want they can stop sinning ...
  

  Thus the internal evidence in its favor is overwhelming.
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  Vidiot

  Ireneus - "Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root..."

  Funny, I would have thought that the root of JWs' "diminishing glory" was that they were... well... wrong.
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  steve2

  Many a false doctrine takes root and spreads like a weed and, looking at its pervasive reach, declares itself to be a true doctrine. For how else would the doctrine have taken root and spread were it false?
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  Ireneus

  Cofty,

  God would be totally unmoved by any allegation one of His creatures makes, and He would naturally be dismissive as expressed by you. Getting upset by allegation and becoming vindictive is the sign of ego—something God would never cultivate for Himself. Such anthropomorphic concepts about God crept into the Bible keeps many right-minded people away from Scriptures altogether. Thus, religions, by their mouth, teach God exists; and by their actions teach God doesn’t exist.
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  Ireneus

  Hi Steve2,

  Good observation.

  My point was to highlight the fact that no story should be shunned on the basis of geography, but should be accepted if they contain good moral whether such stories are historical or not, biblical or of pagan origin. For example, the famous critics (like F.H.A. Scrivener …) have given very powerful argument in favor genuineness of the account in John 8:1-11. Even Professor Bruce Metzger of Princeton University, a renowned textual scholar concedes that “the account has all the earmarks of historical veracity…throughout the history of the church it has been held that, whoever wrote [this section], this little story is authentic” (Morris1971, 883). Interestingly, accusers were themselves violating the very Law which they now try to uphold. Accusers declared that the poor woman had been caught “in the very act” which means they also knew the man, hence both the adulteress and the adulterer be subjected to the same penalty (Leviticus 20:10; Deuteronomy 22:22). Yet they let off the man, but brought only the woman. Behaviour of Jesus in this incident was totally theocratic and praise-worthy.
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  Drearyweather

  On an individual level, people can believe any story that they want whether historical or not. You can even make up stories to further your point. But a story cannot be attributed to Jesus because it is moral and fits the narrative.

  However, if you are tasked to prepare an edition of the Holy Bible, then you are bound to include only stories that are accepted as historical and appeared in the earliest canons. If such unverified stories are included, then the book should be entitled: "Ethical stories of the past", and not the Holy Bible.

  It's like preparing a corporate presentation for your client about your services. You can't include a case study of a project just because it looks good and is appealing. It needs to be verified, authentic, true and a project handled by you.