Why Do JWs Come Here to Debate?

by Victor_E 25 Replies latest jw friends

  • Victor_E
    Victor_E

    Happy man I am going to pretend you are for real. If you read carefuly this is a JW discussion forum. It is one thing to discuss issues in a spirit of understanding, and another to come here with a closed mind simply to prove how right you are. Some ex JWs are just as adamit about their views without any empathy for JWs, this I know for I have been there myself. In the big scheme of things my take is we are spirits that came here to carry out a certain contract with life and part of our preparation was to enroll in the school of hard knocks namely JWs. They are no different from other high control and manipulative groups. As we mature in our spiritual evolution we awaken to the hypocrisy and the tyranical treatment we once considered "spiritual". That is the begining of the end for many of us and we are pulled to walk our own path, blah blah blah. So if you are an infant soul in need of JWs all the power to you my friend.

    He that does not know that he does not know, shun him for he is a fool.

    He that knows but is not knowing, wake him up for he is asleep.

    He that knows that he does not know, teach him.

    He that knows that he knows, learn from him.

    Arabic proverb

  • Victor_E
    Victor_E

    Happy man I am going to pretend you are for real. If you read carefuly this is a JW discussion forum. It is one thing to discuss issues in a spirit of understanding, and another to come here with a closed mind simply to prove how right you are. Some ex JWs are just as adamit about their views without any empathy for JWs, this I know for I have been there myself. In the big scheme of things my take is we are spirits that came here to carry out a certain contract with life and part of our preparation was to enroll in the school of hard knocks namely JWs. They are no different from other high control and manipulative groups. As we mature in our spiritual evolution we awaken to the hypocrisy and the tyranical treatment we once considered "spiritual". That is the begining of the end for many of us and we are pulled to walk our own path, blah blah blah. So if you are an infant soul in need of JWs all the power to you my friend.

    He that does not know that he does not know, shun him for he is a fool.

    He that knows but is not knowing, wake him up for he is asleep.

    He that knows that he does not know, teach him.

    He that knows that he knows, learn from him.

    Arabic proverb

  • happy man
    happy man

    wictor.

    This was to complicated fore mee, even if you putt it in 3 times, be more openminded, my friend,you dont now what is the truth, and i we can only guess what we bellive is the best thing fore us, fore some JW is the best, mostley them how never have any trubbel, or never have sen the backside , others like many here have been badley hurt, and are wery angry, who am I to tell if this was unfair or not.

    And yes I am ore real elder fore over 20 year, but not now.

  • minimus
    minimus

    I believe some JW's ACTUALLY believe or WANT to believe what they are espousing. I don't know about all the hidden motivations. Nearly all of the ones that you described could be attributed to any poster here, especially the "heavies". Regarding ones like Happyman, I am skeptical. The argument that this is JW Discussion means that either a real JW is ignorant or coy, if they think that the GB is suggesting that it's fine for them to be here.Everytime HM says this, he sounds silly. If I were here to go a few rounds with someone, it would be to prove that my point is correct and reasonable. a Watchtower defender cannot do this, and either deep down inside they know it but won't admit it or they haven't seen the light yet.

  • Elsewhere
    Elsewhere

    The sign says: Everyone Welcome

  • TheStar
    TheStar

    Happy Man,

    Do you not have a "V" on your keyboard? His name is Victor not Wictor.... I'm sorry it's just a little difficult to take you seriously with what appears to be a purposed misspelling...

  • happy man
    happy man

    The star.

    I can tell you I spell bad even in swedish.

    When i write on some swed bods they say the same as you, we can not take you serius, when you spell so bad, i call them spellterrorists, they are like pharises, se only smll things who are wrong and dont get the messege.

    ofcourse i could putt upp evry word in a book and do this perfekt, but i have no time fore that, take it or leave it.

    HM

  • Phil
    Phil

    happyman:

    Only too frequently, "man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest"

  • Phil
    Phil

    Victor:

    "He that knows that he knows, learn from him"

    How does one know if he really knows. For instance, a JW elder or board member will probably think he would qualify as knowing the truth, although a DF'd JW would think otherwise. Also the DF'd person would probably think that he qualifies as knowing. Am I missing the boat here? Would God be the final answer?

  • Victor_E
    Victor_E
    How does one know if he really knows. For instance, a JW elder or board member will probably think he would qualify as knowing the truth, although a DF'd JW would think otherwise. Also the DF'd person would probably think that he qualifies as knowing. Am I missing the boat here? Would God be the final answer?

    Hi Phil,

    The original line from the proverb actually says, “He that he knows that he knows, follow him”. I have changed it to learn from him due my personal belief of never following anyone regardless of what they know or who they are.

    As far as how can you identify “he that knows” is a question of finding the expert in a certain context. In order to do that you must have some criteria for what you are going to consider expert. This takes us to relativity meaning that it’s going to be relative to your own personal criteria, values, belief system, etc. etc.. In plain English your criteria for expert may differ from mine but ultimately it’s your call. You will have to live with the consequences of what beliefs you buy into. The more at stake the more the criteria and the longer time required to change my beliefs.

    My criteria for finding, “he that he knows” is:

    a) Can he give me both sides and the complete panoramic view of an issue?

    b) Can he help me to ask the right questions and direct where I can do my own research, to come to my own conclusion?

    c) Can he explain to me how he came to his educated opinions?

    d) Does he have original fresh ideas or is he merely repeat what he has been indoctrinated with?

    e) Does his knowledge resonate as true or does it sound hollow?

    f) Does he have a vested interest in me believing as he does?

    g) Can he tell me what his critics would say of his opinions and can he in a simple and concise way explain to me what facts his critics are missing to not concur with him?

    h) I ask myself what are the consequences of believing and not believing this new opinion as fact.

    I make it my policy never to listen nor take advice from anyone who had not done successfully what I am attempting to do. While I am a trained skeptic, I am at times skeptical of my own skepticism when it comes to spiritual truths. This allows me to be open but not gullible. As far as God being the final answer I would say yes and no. No in that he gave me a brain with unlimited potential to be used in my best interests. Yes when I have done all within my power and I still am missing something. This is when I surrender to that higher power to lead me to find what I need.

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