An 11-year-old boy is in custody for murder for shooting and killing an eight-year-old neighbour girl with a shotgun . . .

by nicolaou 73 Replies latest social current

  • OrphanCrow
    OrphanCrow
    Marvin:
    The cultural bravado of persons willing to prepare themselves with firearms to use in defense of themselves and others is a natural corollary to a willingness to enter live-fire conflicts for essentially the same purpose on a larger scale.

    Then the US should have been the first up to the plate, using that logic.

    They weren't. If Japan had never bombed Pearl Harbour at the end of 1941, the US would never have bothered to "stand up against Hitler". Don't forget, the rest of the world had been engaged in wWW2 for over two years by the time those stalwart, gun toting Americans decided it was time to do something.

    And, in WW1, the US didn't enter the conflict until 1917.

    This whole discussion about gun culture in the US having a bearing on the outcome of wars in the 20th century is really misguided and ridiculous. Very ridiculous. Read a history book, please.

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    I don't know what the solution is. But I feel licensed gun owners are irresponsible is some cases and should be fined or charged and held accountable if their gun is not locked in a safe place when not in use.

    But lots of gun crime occurs when it's the case of an illegal weapon too.

    Is a gun ban really practical and how will it be policed and enforced?

    Very disturbing news

    Kate xx

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    But lots of gun crime occurs when it's the case of an illegal weapon too.

    Is a gun ban really practical and how will it be policed and enforced?

    Good points. In the UK it's illegal to walk around with a gun, but this is only obeyed by people that decide to live within the law. Criminal scum and dodgy people like Mark Duggan simply ignore the law ...

  • cappytan
    cappytan
    But lots of gun crime occurs when it's the case of an illegal weapon too.
    Is a gun ban really practical and how will it be policed and enforced?

    This is a very good point.

    If you want to eliminate mass rampage shootings in the US like the recent Oregon attack, yes, a gun ban could and likely would drastically reduce their occurrence since many times the rampage shooter seems to acquire his weapons in the days or months leading up to the attack.

    However, this would not end gun violence across the board and won't necessarily end rampage killings as a simple google search can show you how to make black powder from common household and hardware store items. The powder can then be made into an IED. America has a problem with crazy people, and crazy people will find a way.

    There are over 300 million guns (and thats a very conservative estimate) owned by private citizens in the U.S. Only a small percentage of them are registered. It would be virtually impossible to collect them all and confiscate them all. At best, only upstanding law-abiding citizens would turn them in. The criminal element, of which a vast majority of gun deaths are attributed to, would have no reason to turn in their arms. And the extreme whack-job anti-government white supremacists wouldn't likely turn theirs in either.

    300 million+ guns, 11,000+ gun deaths in 2013. If a separate gun was used for each death, only 0.004% of private citizen's guns were used. In other words, 99.996% of guns owned by Americans were not used to kill anyone.

    Gun crimes, especially mass killings, get a lot of press and cause a lot of emotions. And the victims of those crimes deserve justice.

    But the stats just don't back up the claim that the cause and reason those crimes were committed was because of a gun culture. If that were true, the number of deaths would be a lot higher.

  • nicolaou
    nicolaou
    I take your point about the criminal element Duggan typifies LUHE but the difference in the UK is that society isn't saturated with weapons to the point where anyone with the smallest grievance can start shooting.
  • freemindfade
    freemindfade

    If you take a quick google search of statistic for gun violence in just Chicago last week, you would see there is A LOT of gun violence, murders. This stuff doesn't make headlines, anyone wonder why?

    Well it doesn't support the emotional value cappy is talking about.

    There is a lot of gun violence going on, most of it with illegally obtained firearms, and committed by inner city areas ravaged with crime and poverty. But this is fulfills no ones agenda. its swept under the media rug. While a gut wrenchingly tragic story such as this one, is at the top of the news feed. All while this has been going on IN JUST CHCAGO.

    Year To Date

    Shot & Killed: 352

    Shot & Wounded: 2002

    Total Shot: 2354

    Total Homicides: 400

    These numbers are staggering! and you never hear them. You only hear about the deranged person who stock piled weapons in their home, then one day carried out their premeditated personal act of terrorism. Or something like this very sad story, it invokes strong emotion. It also lends to the paranoia that many of you outside of the US have acknowledged goes on here, that everyone you see is a walking armory about to lost their mind and shoot everyone. and the paranoia FEEDS the behavior of mass shootings, every single spree shooting in America recalls and immortalizes the shooters before, because they see the EFFECT and ATTENTION it gets. Everyone knows their names now, they aren't nobodies anymore... This is an adjuvant problem we now have to live with, just like if a radical islamist decides in the UK or Australia to hit someone with a car then decapitate them in the street... the paranoia and coverage of our information age may embolden the next monster to try to "one-up" the last one.

  • cappytan
    cappytan

    Why someone disliked FMF's post, I don't know. Do you disagree with the facts and analysis?

    If so, speak up.

  • freemindfade
    freemindfade

    I am not trying to say guns aren't a problem

    I am not advocating for any type of gun freedom agenda

    I am simply stating that when I hear people outside this country speak of paranoia then buy in, they need to take a step back. Some of the things I hear are WAAAAYYYY off. The impression is people are walking down the street with guns strapped to their side, having shoot outs in the streets. Thats only really happening in the places no one is seeing on the news. And that image has little to do with one of these sadistic school shooters, or negligent parents.

    Just calling it what it is outside of the paranoid bubble

    Peace and love

  • SecretSlaveClass
    SecretSlaveClass

    Sorry I'm the moron that accidently hit the dislike trying to hit like while on the treadmill. 😕.

    Naturally I agree with FMF, he's absolutely correct. Violence in low income areas where education, social amenities and lack of sincere leadership and role models is a serious issue which in my opinion transcends the topic of firearms. It's a problem which politicians and the public at large simply refuse to adress and deal with honestly. Until a concerted effort is made to solve these problems, violence in these areas will persist. Firearm control will help to a degree but will never solve the problem simply because these high crime areas have ready access to illegal firearms from within and without the US.

  • blondie
    blondie

    There is no evidence that the Oregon shooter obtained his guns illegally. Yes, all people in the US have guns, illegally. Not me.

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