I had a similar discussion with a pair of Mormons who came to my door - they also told me that God is made of flesh and bone (but not blood, I think). My response was: "So does God have legs?" They replied that he does indeed. I asked what he used them for - after all, he doesn't really need to walk anywhere does he? Why would he have legs? That kinda stumped Mormon 1, but Mormon 2 stepped in and said that he thinks maybe sometimes God likes to walk around among his creation. Yeah, maybe, lol.
Just recovering from a 'Mormon Mind Melt' ...
by LoveUniHateExams 18 Replies latest jw experiences
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maksutov
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Heaven
Mormons were found by a fraudster. I think that says it all. -
LoveUniHateExams
Mormon 2 stepped in and said that he thinks maybe sometimes God likes to walk around among his creation
I guess that would explain all the Bigfoot sightings ...
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SecretSlaveClass
Before I moved out to New York with my wife I stayed in Park City, Utah from 1998-2003. Many of my friends were Mormons and used the opportunity to pick their brains and read their literature. Although I found their beliefs easy to tear apart (claiming that there were ancient Israelite and other kingdoms on the Americas continents but zero archeological evidence to support this), they never once got offended, but merely chose to dodge questions the way all ideologists do. In my opnion the religion is truly a "clown" religion in how preposterous their claims are:
1) Jesus returned a second time just to annoint the US and its people as the new Holy Land with a new chosen people. No records of such an event has ever been found.
2) The angel Moroni showed Joseph Smith the sacred golden plates and was told to bury them near his home. These big, solid gold plates have never been found, despite only have been burried around 1823 and that area of New York being heavily excavated and built on.
3) There were feudal kingdoms akin to the great kindgdoms of the Middle East in the Americas, yet apart from those mighty civilizations of South America, nothing even close has ever been discovered on the North American continent, which is just silly considering the development in the US yet no one has stumbled on any of this mighty kingdoms.
I chose these points because they don't challenge the concept of magical beings, but common sense when one considers the lack of archeological evidence to support these claims. In terms of practical argument, their claims are absurd.
What really struck me are how many misconceptions there are regarding their beliefs and lifestyles.
1) They don't have sex through bedsheets
2) Mormons practicing polygamy are ostracized by the mainstream Mormons
3) Mormons do not shun
4) Mormons only constitute about 40% of the Salt Lake City and surrounding counties population.
5) Mormons do not own all or even most of Salt Lake City's real estate.
What I did like about them is how proud they are of their outdoors. When I was last there (2014) there was no litter to speak of everywhere we went. Entire communities volunteer to keep their alloted areas clean. The health care system is also regarded as one of the best in the country.
The religion itself may be for clowns, but I really liked the people.
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cultBgone
SSC: 2) The angel Moroni showed Joseph Smith the sacred golden plates and was told to bury them near his home. These big, solid gold plates have never been found, despite only have been burried around 1823 and that area of New York being heavily excavated and built on.
He didn't happen to live near Warwick, did he? Maybe the plates are at the bottom of that lake.(Sorry, just couldn't help myself.)
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Crazyguy
Man has created God in his own image. And they call me crazyguy. -
HB
My sister and I chatted with two young Mormons on the High Street in Romford, Essex.
One was American with stunning ‘Hollywood A-list’ good looks, age about 28, tall and slim; the other was a quiet red-head from Sweden with a chunky build, maybe aged about 20. The good looking one did most of the talking. I strongly suspected that the Swedish guy had doubts about his faith and was not enjoying missionary service.
A few years ago, I would not have had a clue how to talk with them, (I've never been a JW) but regularly reading debates on this forum has taught me a lot. I still have much to learn and I don’t know the bible like most of you here do, so I steer clear of deep biblical debate, but I enjoyed the challenge of making the Mormons think. My sister is a Humanist like me, and although she has no experience at all of debating religious issues, she is very chatty and sociable.
We talked for about half an hour, it was very friendly. During the conversation, my sister asked the Mormons why they dressed so stuffily in suits, and suggested they would have better success engaging with people if they looked more normal, especially in Romford. She recommended T-shirt and jeans which would be appropriate for their age and the town. The older one said their suits were a symbol to demonstrate their respect for a righteous life style, the younger one just looked embarrassed and uncomfortable as if he’d love to rip his jacket and tie off there and then.
My sister invited them to come out with us later that evening to join a group of our friends in the pub, explaining that although we would be having fun, no one would be unrighteous. The American naturally declined the invitation, but we just knew the Swede would have loved to join us, his eyes gave it away.
We covered several topics but the one I recall best was asking if they had ever personally experienced a prayer being answered. The examples they gave were not impressive, and quite superficial, like a headache being cured, but they assure me others had had miraculous answers to prayer.
I asked them why God would take the time to cure a slightly inconvenient headache but fail to answer prayers for starving people in the developing world. The good looking Mormon said that if God didn’t answer such prayers, it must be his will for these people to starve. My sister asked how they could worship a god who behaved like that. I asked if he would be prepared to tell that to the mother of a baby in arms who was dying of mal-nutrition.
The answer he gave stunned me: He said the baby would be better off dead as it would go to Heaven and therefore bypass all the suffering it would have endured on the earth. I gasped slightly and said derisively, in that case, as an act of kindness, why don’t we just go and kill all the babies and young children in the third world right now to save them the bother of living?
The Swede hung his head and was staring at the floor, looking really uncomfortable, and shifting from foot to foot. The American looked confused and embarrassed, and just said that was not quite what he meant. However I knew the point was made so I didn’t spoil the friendly atmosphere by pushing it further and we thanked them for an interesting chat and moved on.
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rebel8
They have hidden scandals in their history, just like wts. For example, the women used to be allowed to have >1 husband. This is not widely known among Mormons. It is on ancestry dot com. You can show them those things and it will be a shock to them.
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Vidiot
I think the Proposition 8 scandal embarrassed the LDS so much that it empowered and enabled the more liberal elements of the Mormon leadership to take the church in the direction it really needed to go (to survive in the Information Age), and we're seeing the results.