I remember a brother in 1998 saying that the new paperback yearbooks showed the society was short of money. It's been a long rot that started when they couldn't charge for the literature any more and the "donation arrangement" began.
Where has all the money gone?
by gingerbread 48 Replies latest jw friends
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Crazyguy
People in this organization are just plain poor. Especially all the new ones that have come in from Latin America and Africa where most of the growth has been over the last 20 years. The financial crash of 2008 made it painfully obvious that the Borg wasn't getting as many donations as they hoped. Maybe before 2008 they we're able to prop up themselves with investments but those profits went away.
I remember back in 08 working in an industry we're most of the profits to the companies came from their sales. They had two other departments that could and did maken them money but these we're not as profitable and or as glamorous. When the crash hit the sales end was done and these guys we're scrambling around trying to figure out how the two other departments could make them more money. With no experience outside the sales division they we're like fish out of water.
I think the Borg leaders reacted much the same way after 2008. The money from their stock and real estate investments was gone so they started selling off first branches then new York properties to stay afloat until the economy got better. When it did they thought they could go back to business as usual thats why they made statement about so much growth and new building to go on in the future a year ago or so. But then it's like some one from accounting sat these clowns down and showed them that the investment money hasn't come back and the donation money is just a small percentage of what they used to get. This accountant maybe an outside firm then showed them that the glory days we're over religion as a whole is dieing in the western world and people do to inflation are not going to donate as much any more. So its like this accounting firm said your done now make the most of what you can in the near future and then if you want to try to squeeze more out of their dead cold hand you may be able to but don't bother investing or spending to much in any part of your religion that doesn't get you a return on investment. So no more paying missionarys ,special pioneers, etc because no ones joining from outside the borg and if they are thier to poor to make us any money. Let's down size to reduce costs as much as possible so we can continue to ride this gravy train for a few more years.
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stan livedeath
going back 50 years to my late teens--i was a regular pio and a servant then------i was in a working class congregation--most of the men had jobs--but low incomes--and several mouths to feed.
the donated income was very low----mainly due to the "jehovah will provide " attitude---meaning someone else will stump up.
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ScenicViewer
WT is into something, just what that is at this point has us all for now, but sooner or later we will know, sooner or later.
I hope so. There seem to be more and more leaks, Bethel insiders leaking out letters, announcements, and other information. I can't wait til there is significant leak of Watchtower finances. We have never known how much money comes in to the Organization and where it comes from, or how much goes out and where it goes to.
Wouldn't it be nice to have that revealed? I hope it happens in my lifetime.
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eyeuse2badub
Sales is the lifeline for every corporation. Sales dry up and corporations go bankrupt. Business basics 101 right?
What is the Watchtower Corporation selling now? It ain't printed literature nor 'miracle wheat' that's for sure. They can only sell so much real estate before the 'rank and file' rebel. "The end is near" for the wtbts. Let us pray.
just saying!
eyeuse2badub
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OnTheWayOut
I will have to go back and read other comments as I am sure there are great insights here.
As far as my understanding goes, Watchtower was a giant printing corporation. They sold literature. Their conventions were huge sales seminars for their unpaid sales force, who also happened to be big customers. So they were like Avon or Amway in that the customers went out and sold the product, but they had a huge advantage in that it wasn't a pyramid. The sales force were not taking a cut. I am sure it was awesome.1975 was a huge push to sell more and pay for the modernization of the printing company. It worked no matter what happened to the membership when the end didn't come. And more new members stayed rather than left anyway compared to their slower growth if they didn't have the 1975 campaign.
So the trouble comes from the printing company mentality set in those days lingering today. Selling more literature seemed always to be better for the company than selling less. When they were going to have to pay taxes if they didn't switch to donations, they chose donations. And the slow death of Watchtower started. It was slow because they had modern efficient presses and a volunteer (below minimum wage cost to them) work force. They still made money with their blatant disregard for the laws concerning "donation-only" standards and they told congregations what inflated amounts they SHOULD be paying for the literature.
As time went by, the lawyers told them they couldn't keep insisting on given amounts from congregations for literature. They eventually switched to insisting on given amounts for all other things- C.O. expenses, donations for the worldwide work, yadda yadda. The bulk of the donations in the 1980's switched from nonmember contributions (for literature) to member contributions. If money is chiefly coming straight from hardworking members, then no matter what changes were made over the years, all they were doing was shifting profits from literature to something else- donations at assemblies, donations from the congregations, donations from the buying and selling of properties including Kingdom Halls.
Once you've taken all the money from the congregations and told them they aren't donating enough monthly, all they will do is take their "Worldwide Work" money and money normally dropped in the box at the Assembly Hall and drop it in the local contribution box at the Kingdom Hall to meet the monthly demand. So they just robbed Peter to pay Paul.
The problem would be self correcting if the printing corporation recognized the drying up of money for literature and reduced spending. But it could not reduce it fast enough. There were lawsuits. And there were huge leftover facilities and personnel from the days when they needed that to produce the literature. The facilities are being sold, but in an economy that fetches far less profit than it would have a decade ago. And waiting for the personnel to die wasn't fast enough.
I doubt today's average JW donates as much as members did in previous decades. It's not that they don't want to, but it's just that they don't have it. The mentality of JW's has always been to give time more than money, but they gave what they could. Now, these people who did not go to college and did not accept all the overtime at work and may have turned down jobs that caused them to miss meetings- they just don't have the money to give. The cost of living has risen, taxes have risen, the demands of Watchtower have risen. But the collections are still anonymous and, just like I did at one time, members (rightly so) assume that Jehovah will provide for "His" organization if that is His will, and they give less.
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eyeuse2badub
OnTheWayOut
Amen brother. Excellent summation! Do you think the next step for watchtower is to go from anonymous contributions to regulated (direct withdrawal from a bank account) "contributions"?
It looks to me that watchtower is going to have to mirror the mormons even more than they do already.
just saying!
eyeuse2badub
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pontoon
All above interesting speculation on what is going on. My thoughts... I always felt the corp was so rich they couldn't spend it fast enough, I still don't discount that. Remember, they don't build KH's, the locals pay for them. When I worked construction the largest project I was involved with was $15,000,000, Warwick has to be 20x bigger than that. GB members don't get any more money (not looking at perks) than any other Bethelite, or are they just allowing us to believe that? On a assembly hall project I know for a fact that certain "volunteers" were paid to be there full time, which is OK but still very undercover, I'm sure there are ways checks can be written. Assemblies, especially in corp owned halls are HUGE money makers. Even in poorer halls often there is one or two people that have a lot of money and are the financial backbone of the hall. They take a personal pride/responsibility in keeping the hall's bank account in good shape. With the corp robbing the hall's money the wallets of those benefactors will stay closed -
Billy the Ex-Bethelite
OTWO: The problem would be self correcting if the printing corporation recognized the drying up of money for literature and reduced spending. But it could not reduce it fast enough.
Agreed. And as WT reduced spending with cheaper publications, fewer magazines, and cutting the magazine pages in half, the donations from publishers would easily decrease into a downward spiral. With every cutting of cost that publishers could see, why would they keep donating the same?
And with no defined price on the publications and DVDs, it's completely at the whim of the sheeple to donate or not donate for the stuff. And with their shift away from printing and toward online content, expenses will continue and income will continue the decline. Who pays for web content that it freely available? Who donates money to YouTube or Facebook?
The old publication sales and profit model has completely collapsed.
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Phizzy
" The old publication sales and profit model has completely collapsed. "
Quite right, and it seems as though they thought replacing that model with the "Build, Sell, Rinse, Repeat" model would replace it with ease.
It hasn't, combining Congregations, selling off old K.H's, and even Bethels and Assembly Halls, all takes time, resulting in major cash flow problems.