do people at JCs pretty much have to cry to show that they are repentant? I've always wondered that.
? for current or former Elders
by Azalo 27 Replies latest jw friends
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BluesBrother
No! . In fact I can remember some instructor at an elders seminar warning against being taken in by a woman "Who could turn on a flood of tears" - Tough old so and so !
Elders look for repentance . They have to be convinced that the errant one is truly sorry and has learned from the experience and will not do it again . They are human and many of us men can be moved by a woman who gives way to tears . But they have to believe they are 100% genuine
Good luck if you should have a hearing coming up.
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Gopher
I'm not an elder, and have never been one. But I was on the receiving end of a disfellowshipping hearing and subsequently was DF'd (facts be damned).
I was unemotional during my hearing, just laying out what I recalled did and didn't happen, what I did wrong and not.
I got DF'd anyhow. Perhaps if I started sniffling a bit, tearing up -- maybe that would have swung things my way. But it would have really been insincere of me.
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rocketman
I did serve on several jc's in my time as an elder, and yes, we were, as Blesbro mentions, cautioned about being faked out by tears. On the other hand, tears could indicate true sorrow over something done. It's all on a case-by-case basis.
Like Gopher implies, once elders do get into their heads that you are guilty, facts notwithstanding, there may not be much you can do. I've seen that mentality - get a group of men together to sit as judges, and they seldom will admit they might be wrong or could misjudge a case. It's a collective ego thing from what I saw.
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peacefulpete
They will seek "Fruits that befit repentence". (Luke and Matt 3:8 weird ha?) This is very open to subjective judgement, some will be impressed with simple meeting attendence while others expect more radical sacrifice. If the crime was wronging another it is normal to make amends if possible. If it was sexual they may be expected to change their wardrobe, move, change jobs what ever they determine were contributing to your "fall into sin". Tears never hurt. But begging incites anger and suspition and feeds the power sensation felt by the JC. Speak very self deprecating. "I'm worthless, how could Jehovah forgive me!!?" Ask for their help earnestly. Never offer any "reason" you did what ever you did, this appears as defending yourself. Never blame others even subtlely. Avoid eye contact this is perceived as defiance or lack of humility. This will work unless they don't like you anyway and have been hoping for this oppotunity to "remove" you. I was unfortunately part of this. They are men but men with a unique mindset that favors a "crushed spirit." If your crime was serious doubts or apostacy your screwed as they are only going thru a formality to documet your "sin".
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rocketman
Speak very self deprecating. "I'm worthless, how could Jehovah forgive me!!?" Ask for their help earnestly. Never offer any "reason" you did what ever you did, this appears as defending yourself. Never blame others even subtlely. Avoid eye contact this is perceived as defiance or lack of humility.
Very true pete. It's an odd mentality on those jc's. You get three judges together, and it's an exercise in condesencsion. And the person there had better be "humble" so as not to give the impression of many not having their spirit fully crushed.
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Mulan
2 former elders here at the Freedom Fest say................."it was really annoying when they cried..............we had to wait until they had their emotions under control before we could proceed." My hubby says "it doesn't necessarily show repentance.................it shows emotion."
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minimus
If someone SINCERELY cried, it made a difference. If someone was just emotional, it was dismissed.....Minimus, who served in over 100 JC cases.
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rocketman
Wow, 100 jc's for minimus! I vote for a username change to Minimus Wapner.
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logansrun
Okay, how about vomitting? Is that a mark of repentence?
B