RUSSIA: Jehovah's Witnesses face possible liquidation

by AndersonsInfo 57 Replies latest jw friends

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  Fisherman

  the Earth was the center of the univ... Vid

  Depends on what side agrees to support that.
  
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  DJS

  Yes, Fish, those dub families are all just peachy and thriving.

  A conservative estimate suggests 20% of current members would leave tomorrow if the shunning policy was abolished. Shunning destroys families, contributes depression and other mental problems, contributes to drug and alcohol abuse and an increase in government services. Exiting from this hate filled cult is similar to the Von Trap family getting the hell out of Austria lest they be outed to the Nazis. Does that not register with you? Let me say this again; those leaving this vile, nasty cult have to act like the Von Traps as they fled the Nazis and Hitler. Get it?

  The religious group in the US and likely every other W or Industrialized country with the lowest education level is the Jehovahs Witnesses.

  
  

  The religious group in the US and likely every other W or Industrialized country with the lowest family income is the Jehovahs Witnesses.

  
  

  It is only rational to suggest that the JWs utilize government benefits at the highest level.

  
  

  The following conscience matters can get you DFed: Voting, Celebrating Birthdays, Halloween, Christmas, Valentines Day, etc. Fish, these are CONSCIENCE matters, yet the old white males (and one token) have made laws out of all of them.

  
  

  The following conscience matters can get you marked, provisionally 'shunned' and have you judged and avoided by your fellow dubs: music, hair, clothes, sports, education, profession, extra-curricular school actives such as proms, dances, attending YMCA, joining civic clubs (Optimist, Kiwanis, etc.)

  
  

  The dubs are similar to the Southern US in the 1950s and 1960s. White flight is occurring at an enormous pace. The % of whites in the religion has dropped from 48% to 36% between 2007 and 2014. They are also bleeding men. 65% of dubs are female. The Jehovahs Witnesses have the 3rd oldest group of members and the least amount of young people of all US religions.

  
  

  There is no reason to think that the same demographic changes are not occurring in every other industrialized nation.

  
  

  This cult is dangerous. Their young leave; their males leave; their educated leave; their whites leave. Many of their older members are economically disadvantaged due to sitting around and waiting on the Big A rather than working, saving and investing.

  
  

  None of that suggests a healthy environment and there is nothing, absolutely nothing on the horizon that suggests these trends won't continue. There isn't a kinder gentler group of Dark Lords waiting in the wings to fix all of this. This isn't a matter of suggesting the remaining demographic makeup is somehow inferior as children of a lesser god. That isn't the point. The point is that this hateful cult is driving away several demographic groups due to its policies and practices.

  
  

  As for Vlad the Impaler, he has every right to view this end of time hate filled segregationist, conscience, goal, ambition, hope, dream and aspiration killing cult as extreme.

  
  

  Let's hope that other nations will follow suit. Soon.

  
  
• 

  Vidiot

  Fisherman - "Depends on what side agrees to support that."

  Um... what???

  Okay, I'm starting to think that you're either punking us in long-con format, or you are the living embodiment of Poe's Law.
  
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  Not This

  Are the jws being thrown in jail in Russia?

  I heard the government is planting jw literature and then arresting jws because of it. Heard via JW grapevine?
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  Fisherman

  Um... what???

  IN other words, you equate millions and millions of JW that disagree with DJS with the millions concluded that the earth was flat.

  Their teachings and behaviors destroy families and rob individuals of personal conscience, freedom of choice, dreams, hopes, aspirations and ambitions. Their shunning policy and discouraging education create a strain on government resources, not to mention failing to contribute to the greater good of social and economic improvement. (in reference to JW)

  Again, I strongly disagree and so do millions of JW!! They feel that: Their families are not destroyed, they profess to enjoy a clean conscience, they are happy with their choice to be JW and no regrets and would make the same choice again, they strive to be honest productive members of society. And they don't retaliate vindictively or use political power to go after other religions or other entities that make trouble for them -they trust God for justice. Of course, you cannot please everybody and people leave JW, some after gazing at the temporary pleasures the world has to offer, others get angry at jw.

  Nothing in DJS commentary shows or establishes any extremism different from other religions that is practiced by jw that the Russians or anybody else should go after wt and stop them from enjoying their freedom of worship in-spite of the posted colorful hatred and ill will towards wt. The opposite is true,WT does not hate anybody or tries to stop anybody and does not resort to framing trouble by decree or use the government to stop what goes against wt teaching such as other BABYLONISH religions, abortion, homosexuality, etc.

  I am sure DJS has his reasons for resentment towards wt but millions of other jws support wt and they feel that you believe the earth is flat or the center of the universe -whatever you wish to be true- and they disagree with your side.
  
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  DJS

  Fish,

  Barb’s links would help you understand this issue if you would read them.

  Russia enacted its extremism law in 2002, just months after the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks in the US. Two of the law's provisions defined religious extremism as promoting the "exclusivity, superiority, or lack of equal worth of an individual" and "incitement of religious discord" in connection with acts or threats of violence.

  Officials began to interpret the first provision as promoting the superiority of a belief, and in 2007, Russia amended the law to allow prosecution for inciting religious discord even in the absence of any threat or act of violence.

  Since every group believes its own dogma to be in some sense superior, any group could face an extremism charge. And since inciting "religious discord" is no longer linked to advocating or perpetrating violence, those advocating religious views face potential criminal charges of incitement. Other religious groups wishing to practice openly in Russia either don’t have these teachings as part of their religious dogma or they have removed them from materials distributed in Russia. In other words, they complied with the law.

  In early 2014, a regional court overturned a 2012 ban of the JW website, and in 2015 the Russian Justice Ministry allowed the Jehovah's Witnesses to operate as a legal community in Moscow. So it is clear the Russian judicial system is trying to be fair minded with the dubs. The Dubs continue to place themselves in the cross hairs of Russian laws because they won’t completely remove teachings related to end of time and the complete destruction of all other religions and governments and their own superiority, which Russian law views as extremist and dangerous.

  It’s not just the dubs. A court in 2007 banned the Russian translations of 14 Quran commentaries by Turkish theologian Said Nursi due to his asserting Islam's superiority. It is important to note that followers of Islam in Russia have disavowed Nursi’s writings, distanced themselves from ISIS and other Islamic extremists who preach jihad, the forced spread of Islam, end of time armageddons and superiority over other religions. In September 2013, the Novorossiisk District Court banned a translation of the Quran itself and ordered its destruction, a ruling that was overturned three months later.

  The Dark Lords can’t be the Dark Lords without preaching and teaching that they alone have god’s spirit and every other religion and government will soon be destroyed. That is why they are in trouble; they do not deserve our sympathy, and the Russian judicial system has shown restraint and patience, systematically trying to get the Dark Lords and others to comply.

  Does Vlad protect the Russian Othrodox Church? Of course. Is Russia reverting back to the pre-Cold War days of suppression and oppression? Perhaps a bit, but the Russian courts are acting like courts in other democratic countries; some interpret the laws one way, and other courts interpret the laws in a different way. The process is working so far; the only thing not working is the arrogant self appointed narcissistic ego driven Dark Lords, who will be forced to re-write every publication distributed in Russia and every teaching proselytized in public in order to comply with the law and avoid being dissolved. My money is on Vlad and his Impalers, and unless the Russian law is changed, which is unlikely to occur, the Dark Lords are going to be on the losing side of this in Russia and unlikely to gain sympathy from the EU. X-tian apologists may whine about it, but Russia has shown restraint, patience and is well within its rights to place reasonable limits on religious freedom.

  Religions in Russian and everywhere else are free to believe what they wish. Teaching these beliefs to others and acting on them are a much different matter. I may believe I can fly. But I don’t act on it because I can’t, and I don’t teach others that they can fly because they can’t either. There are many cities that have laws against trying to fly off of buildings, with or without parachutes or mechanical aids and irrespective of one’s attempts to kill one-self. The reason is that your stupid falling body may harm others.

  In early US history, Puritans routinely publicly humiliated ‘sinners’ in stockades, burned a few ‘witches’ at the stake and killed a few heretics and children for various ‘crimes’ against the church. Churches supported bans on blacks marrying whites and marriages between gays and lesbians. Religious ‘freedom’ is not a guarantee and every nation/state has a compelling interest and right to place appropriate, rational limits on religion. Warren Jeffs is in prison for a reason.

  Governments have an inherent right to establish laws that will limit a group’s abilities to harm others. That is all this is about. Vlad and his Impalers believe the Dark Lords are dangerous and can bring no long term good to his country.

  And they are right.
• 

  zeb

  Back to the first posting unless I missed it what were the wt in Russia warned about?

  thanks.
  
• 

  TheFadingAlbatros

  The Russians know how to dance, and when they drank vodka they are not about to accept everything coming from the USA, Take care WT princes, dukes, kings and priests :

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDfbeMwnK3I