Trinity...cross...Does it matter?

by NikL 39 Replies latest jw friends

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  NikL

  I've been thinking about this for a while.

  Did Jesus diee on a cross? Does it really matter? It doesn't change anything that I can see.

  Is god a trinity? Again, who cares? Jesus still told us to pray to our heavenly father.

  I think it is inevitable that we will never have the complete picture of spiritual things as long as we are physical beings. It seems to me people make mountains out of molehills over things we can't possibly know for certain in this life. At the end of the day the commands of Jesus...weather he was god incarnate or died on a cross stay the same.

  What do you think?
  
• 

  OUTLAW

  Trinity...cross...Does it matter?

  It won`t make anyones life better..
  

  It won`t change the weather..

  ......
  

  I`m Still Having..

  Chicken Curry For Dinner..
  
• 

  cofty

  What do you think?

  I think your post reveals a lot of presuppositions.
  
  
• 

  Village Idiot

  The trinity part is tricky. There are scriptures both for and against it implying that there were two different strains of beliefs mixed together. The doctrine of spiritual correctness states that those who do not believe in one or the other will go to hell/die at Armageddon.

  The cross versus pole issue would be unimportant if it weren't for the fact that JWs condemn it as a pagan symbol. This means that those who believe that Jesus died on a cross are going to be destroyed for picturing Jesus' death in the wrong manner.
  
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  Finkelstein

  Archeology has shown that the cross was used in ancient Romans times.

  What the JWS have been trying to bring out is how Christendom uses the Cross as a graven image in its worshiping tradition, which to them is against bible Scripture where doing so is admonished because of its pagan tradition.

  One must keep in mind there is no Trinity in Hebraic religoius teachings, Jesus to them was a prophet or noted Rabbi, not the son of god the Messiah.

  The Trinity came about when Christianity developed. The Father, The Son and The Holy Ghost.
  
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  schnell

  The narrative is that he died on a cross, with a nail in each wrist.

  Oh, the cross is a symbol that clearly had meaning long before the first century AD? Cool. That is part of the narrative too, then.

  To me, the whole thing about no graven images or magic reeks of revisionist politics on the part of perhaps the Deuteronomical class more than anything. You can take out the high places all you want. The Tabernacle was still designed after Egyptian temples.
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  OnTheWayOut

  What do you think?
  

  We haven't even established that a man, let alone "god incarnate" existed at all. And if he did, whether a story about his death and "crucifixion," written long long after his existence was anything close to true. Even if such a man existed and died in such a way, did he have "commands" for us, and should we actually obey such commands? Why?
  
  I think even saying "we will never have the complete picture of spiritual things as long as we are physical beings" indicates that you are a person enjoying the mythical beliefs that faith delivers about living past death. When people enjoy such mythical beliefs, details like what cave, what shroud, what commands, what wooden post, yadda yadda all become very important. But for those that don't believe in Santa Claus, we don't need to know if Rudolf will be needed this year.
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  schnell

  When people enjoy such mythical beliefs, details like what cave, what shroud, what commands, what wooden post, yadda yadda all become very important. But for those that don't believe in Santa Claus, we don't need to know if Rudolf will be needed this year.
  

  As a skeptical person who enjoys myth as myth, of course that is true. If I didn't enjoy it, I wouldn't take initiative to pursue it.

  Personally, what amuses me is the politics of religion. There are always reasons why a cult believes X and not Y, however duplicitous or hypocritical they may be in doing so.
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  Perry

  Is god a trinity? Again, who cares? ...It seems to me people make mountains out of molehills

  
  

  I agree to some extent. Even the new agers seem to agree that we are a trinity: body, soul & spirit. It seems to me that, "Why not God" could just as easily be asked in place of "Why God" when dealing with the trinity issue.
  
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  schnell

  I agree to some extent. Even the new agers seem to agree that we are a trinity: body, soul & spirit. It seems to me that, "Why not God" could just as easily be asked in place of "Why God" when dealing with the trinity issue.

  Yep. A special pioneer once espoused to me that Christendom "wants a schizophrenic god". Because how can one person also be three? Oh, hmm... Except that the WTBTS also explains that any anthropomorphic portrayal of God is simply a portrayal for our own understanding and that He is a spirit... So why not a Trinity then?

  Seriously, at that point, you're in fairyland anyway. Newtonian physics and conventional logic do not apply. Ain't no rule book about how this works.

  ... I'm surprising myself here because I know St. Augustine made a similar argument on the Trinity, that we can't just compare physical things to spiritual things. While in the cult, I often decried St. Augustine's writing on the Trinity.