Field Service

by Ding 21 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Magnum
    Magnum
    Ding: The GB must not believe their own teaching about the imminence of Armageddon.
    If they did, wouldn't they be doubling down instead of making all these changes?

    There have to be some higher-ups who know something is wrong. The JW religion of today is nothing like it was in, for example, the 80's when I was probably at my most zealous point.

    The "preaching" work is just pathetic. Think about this... if the dam is at the head of the valley is about to break any time and you know it, would you inform people in the manner of the JW preaching work now? According to their theology, billions of lives are at stake - BILLIONS! And they're going to just set up a few lame carts with some lame literature that doesn't really warn people at all? And now, they're just going to focus on listening to people and talking about whatever the people want to talk about instead of giving them a strong witness?

    What about the Israelites' marching around Jericho on the seventh day? What about the bold, fearless preaching of the apostles in the city gates, etc.? JW preaching is nothing like any of that.

    I've recently seen a number of YouTube videos by conservative types like Charlie Kirk. Now, please forget the socio-politics; that's not my point; my point is their method. They set up tents on college campuses and other places and welcome the deep questions and challenges and face them head on, unhesitatingly. Whether you agree or disagree with them, wouldn't you admit that they at least give evidence of strongly believing their own stuff and are willing to attempt to back it up? Now, compare that with JWs at carts. They will pack up and leave when presented with material from their own publications. They get looks on their faces indicating insecurity.

    If JWs were who they claim to be, then their preaching should be getting bolder, louder, clearer as the end they foretell supposedly gets closer; yet it's getting weaker, softer, muddier.

    That, to me, is one of the main indicators that they could not be who they claim to be. There is no possible way that a just god could judge humans adversely based on their response to the faint, weak, puny, cowardly, unclear preaching of JWs.

    P.S. And who's just so idle and so lacking a life that they want to have a random lame conversation with JWs? I'm sure there are a few, and those are the only types the JW religion will attract from now on - the lonely, the societal misfits, the unstable, etc. Gone are the days when the religion attracted the thinking, smarter, stable types.

    JWs are legends in their own minds. Do they really think people want to have conversations with them? They are clueless cult nobodies.

  • Magnum
    Magnum
    Jeffro: That [the PR firm thing] certainly seems to be the case.

    Jeffro, do you remember how we discussed that on this forum maybe ten or twelve years ago? A lot us really thought the org had hired a PR firm back then. The changes were so drastic that I remember one poster (I think it was anddon'tcallmeshirley) wrote "What's next - congregation softball teams?" The org was morphing into a softer, more mainstream religion, seemingly trying to be more relevant and appealing. Along came broadcasting, cartoons, news, a talk show, pop-like music with videos, etc. I wish we could find some kind of evidence if they did hire a PR firm.

    And now, no more reporting time and this new softer approach to the ministry.

  • Ding
    Ding

    There was definitely a greater sense of urgency as 1975 neared than there is now.

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    MAGNUM:

    In addition to what you mentioned, what about people harmed by following the religion’s advice?? (People led to believe they didn’t need to prepare for old age and retirement).. How could a just God not understand how misled people were???

    As you know. they discarded that 100 year old teaching about counting time at their annual meeting.. I was judged over this and will never forget!!! Thankfully, I paid no attention years ago and did what I had to do, which was work. (You have mentioned your situation.) What about the many thousands of JWs in a similar or worse predicament now - and at an advanced age no less?

    And no apologies (or anything else) to anybody.

    I wonder what the majority of the JWs really think about these changes.

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost

    LongHairGal:

    I really wonder what the majority of the JWs really think about these changes.

    It’s many years since I was serving(working) in Bethel but I still recall vividly conversations held in hushed tones where we admitted together some doubts. And I’m referring to members of a branch committee no less! so yes, I don’t just wonder, I know.

    The thing is that they have so much invested into life in the borg, that they cannot bring themselves to face up to “the real troof”. Ray Franz referred to their cognitive dissonance.

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost

    @Mikejw

    Hi Mike,

    like I said earlier in this thread, it’s now many years (30+) since I was ‘in’ and there’s been so many changes in that time but can you elaborate on this

    Zoom ministry is just an excuse for a social club. Meeting in people’s homes is usually hybrid groups these days. The ones on zoom get to chat to ones in person attending the group.

    Are the meetings in people’s homes the meetings for field service?

    What on earth is Zoom ministry?

    Cheers, mate

    Ozzie 🍷

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot
    Magnum - “…Jeffro, do you remember how we discussed that on this forum maybe ten or twelve years ago? A lot us really thought the org had hired a PR firm back then. The changes were so drastic that I remember one poster (I think it was anddon'tcallmeshirley) wrote ‘What's next - congregation softball teams?’…”

    Wait, yeah, that does ring a bell.

    Sorry, I know I’m not Jeffro. ☺️

    Magnum - “…I wish we could find some kind of evidence if they did hire a PR firm…”

    Its been confirmed by a couple of (alleged) insiders, along with verification that Top-Shelf was let go ‘cause he wouldn’t play ball.

  • Mikejw
    Mikejw
    It’s many years since I was serving(working) in Bethel but I still recall vividly conversations held in hushed tones where we admitted together some doubts. And I’m referring to members of a branch committee no less! so yes, I don’t just wonder, I know.
    The thing is that they have so much invested into life in the borg, that they cannot bring themselves to face up to “the real troof”. Ray Franz referred to their cognitive dissonance.

    Yes it’s called sunk cost fallacy. I have tried to have conversations about the AGM asking questions about who will survive Armageddon now? They don’t like confronting this question. They really try to avoid it and not think about it.

    I force someone to confront it. We used to believe unrighteous had to die beforehand to make it into the new world. But now they are saying this unrighteous one does not have to die before to make it into the new world.

    If a JW confronts this new light they can’t fail to have doubts about what the GB is saying, and what they have always said.

    I do believe the most profound part of the last AGM was when Br Jackson said “we know some of you were hoping your unrighteous loved ones die before Armageddon!!!!“

    but now they are saying the unrighteous don’t have to die before Armageddon to make it into the new world.

    This is so profound and huge I would say the largest change in the last century or so. And Lloyd either missed it, didn’t understand it or refuses to understand it. He says it’s a nothing burger.

    His best bee in his bonnet was to say that JWs believe that everyone not a JW will be slaughtered at Armageddon. Now this change at the AGM they don’t believe that anymore.

  • Jeffro
    Jeffro

    Magnum:

    Jeffro, do you remember how we discussed that on this forum maybe ten or twelve years ago? A lot us really thought the org had hired a PR firm back then.

    Yes, if not a bit vaguely, and it definitely seems that they did get some PR advice. But I wasn't aware that it was actually confirmed.

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot

    It definitely feels like the hard-hitting-message and the eleventh-hour-salvation thing are at odds, or they’re waffling back and forth…

    …but there is one possibility.

    They may think that the “Hailstone” preaching will compel non-members (or former members) to get (re)join the fold at the last minute…

    because (and this is, admittedly, kind of out there) they’re reserving the “Hailstone” message as a response if/when insolvency forces them to shut down.

    Sort of a “prop us back up or you’re Armageddon Toast” thing.

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