Teejay,
I do not consider my comment to you as an ad hominem, but as an inference, just like your comment that you like me, but you like Zazu better. That was a conclusion on your part based on information, and most people I know would agree with you. So, my conclusion about you is similiar to your statement about the difference between my wife and I - based on qualitative information, which can not be supported by quotes, because quotes are useless in this kind of discussion.
To The Folks
by Farkel 175 Replies latest jw friends
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larc
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AlanF
I'm combining replies to several of Teejay's posts here:
First post:
: Why you insist on missing the point I cannot understand. Well... actually I do.
Not at all. If you did, you'd admit you were wrong and then shut up.
: Your feigned indignation, while precious at first, is becoming a bit tiresome, don't you think? Please do let it go.
I've made the point that you are selective in your reasoning ability. You display a bit when you want to and when it's in your interest, but not otherwise.
DannyBear, in case you missed this, take note:
: Of course I could be wrong but I strongly believe there *is* a Cult of AlanF, a Cult of Farkel, a Cult of JanH, and a cult of kent ...
Need I say more, Danny?
There is no more a "Cult of AlanF" etc. than there is a "Cult of DannyBear".
: Is there a Cult of Ray Franz? You betcha.
I'm sure that would come as news to Franz. If he has any 'cult followers', he certainly hasn't seen them.
: This is not to say that any of you "leaders"
I am not a leader. Never have been, never will be. Only in your warped imagination, obviously fueled by jealousy, are any of those you mentioned 'cult leaders' or leaders of any sort. Even writing a book does not make one a leader. One gains respect, perhaps, but a leader is far more than a book writer.
: ever intended to have a cult following, but one cannot ever have full control over what another one says or does, can they?
DannyBear, I think that by now even you can see the grossly insulting nature of comments like this. Do you think that I try to control anyone? Do you really think that writing words to a discussion board actually controls anyone? Influences, sure, but that's a whole different thing. Our mutual buddy Dave Malone strongly influences me, but he doesn't control me. And vice versa.
: If you think that I accused you of anything when I mentioned the various cults in the ex-JW community then you simply missed the point.
No, you missed the point. You're obviously too stupid to see that telling someone he is a 'cult leader' is grossly insulting when it's not so. As well as being a slanderous lie.
: Further... if any poster stands accused, it is only those posters for whom the shoe fits and no other.
This is one of the most moronic comments I've ever read, even from you, Teejay. It reminds me of something in a Watchtower condemning critics of JWs.
Next post:
:: Nevertheless, the main point I made is that your claims about 'cult leaders and followers' on this board insult everyone and are thoroughly ridiculous and reprehensible.
: They do not insult "everyone."
They insult everyone who happens to agree on any point with those you call 'cult leaders'. Since most everyone agrees with at least some things, you've insulted most everyone.
: My point, as SP so succinctly put it, is that SOME PEOPLE have exchanged one leader for another.
Duh.
Some people, somewhere on earth, can be found who do anything you can think of. We're talking about ex-JWs who inhabit ex-JW discussion boards. Those are the people you spoke about, and those are the ones you've grossly insulted.
: Don't tell me that you universally rule out that as a possibility for all people everywhere. Do you?
What a friggin' moron you are! Now you're backtracking. See my above comment.
:: Now that you see what my ploy was, try going back and seeing what the real point was.
: No, YOU go back to see what MY point was and let's then try this again.
I already did, you moron. You simply refuse to see that your comments are grossly insulting to most board participants. Now you've even managed to embarass one of your defenders, namely DannyBear, by explicitly stating that you really do think that I personally have a cult following, when he thought that's not what you meant at all.
Are you getting this, Danny?
:: Whatever, I'll just do it: I am not a cult leader. Farkel is not a cult leader. No one follows me. No one follows Farkel.
:: Do you understand?
: The point isn't whether you're a leader of a cult. That was NEVER the point.
Then why did you make such an accusation, you lying moron?
: The point is that some people seem to have exchanged the gb for others of the ex-JW community and those who do that will never really be free.
That never was in question. See above.
: Now, do YOU understand? Will you ever?
Oh, I understand you perfectly. Several posters have already indicated that they understand your base motives. You're still using this non-issue to do what you've done consistently on this board -- rant against those you think are "prominent". Only little men do that. Think about that, Teejay.
AlanF
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StinkyPantz
<sigh>
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AlanF
StinkyPantz said:
: First of all I want to say that I really like AlanF,
I like you, too.
: but I disagree with his synopsis of Teejay's words. What I got from what he said was this. It's fine to read another's words and gain incite from them as he did with Franz' book. His problem though, was that some people adopt this new person's ideas (Farkel & AlanF) and stopping thinking for themselves. These same people feel the need to defend their "cult leaders" at every avenue and believe almost everything they say. That's what I got from Teejay's words. . maybe I'm wrong.
You are wrong. I know of no one who adopts any of my ideas, or Farkel's, and then stop thinking for themselves. Do you? Does Teejay? No. I even asked him to prove his point by naming names. No can do. Since no one on this board, or anywhere else for that matter, fits his scenario, it is a false one.
StinkyPantz, by his words Teejay even implied that the information I've given you has the potential to stop you from thinking simply because you've accepted it from me. That's slanderous and insulting.
He has also grossly insulted Wasasister by twisting her words. She happens to be a good friend to me and my wife, and a strongly independent thinker if there ever was one! Watch her kick his sorry ass.
Teejay could have simply said that Farkel is often unnecessarily insulting -- and with that I would agree.
Teejay could have also said that he dislikes the fact that some people he would like to see step up and take some well deserved whacks at Farkel do not do so.
But he didn't stop there. He insulted me and a lot of others besides with slanderous lies. He has done this consistently for the two or so years he has been on this board. I simply will not tolerate such slander. And neither should you.
AlanF
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StinkyPantz
AlanF-
All I can say is that my other comment was what I got from Teejay's words. I suppose if you two have a history then his words might demonstrate a bit of jealousy. I saw his usage of terms like "cult leader" as symbolic. Surely you must realize that many here put you and Farkel and others on pedestal's. After talking to you I can honestly say that you have a way with words and could probably convince me of pretty much anything. Maybe I'm just weak, but I've "met" many people on the board much weaker than I, and some much more suggestable.
I'm not necessarily taking Teejay's side, because he has been pretty hateful to me in the past. All I'm saying is that. . geez, I don't know what I'm saying it's 3 a.m.
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Prisca
But he didn't stop there. He insulted me and a lot of others besides with slanderous lies. He has done this consistently for the two or so years he has been on this board. I simply will not tolerate such slander. And neither should you.
Alan, you are describing Farkel's behaviour towards myself and others over the past two years. That is why some of us aren't sad to see him leave. And that is why some of us are brave enough to say so.
Teejay's post regarding the "cults" of Farkel and AlanF etc are pretty much on the mark. They're not literal cults but those that "belong" are cult-like in certain behaviours. Such as their tolerance of anything Farkel says, including his childish behaviour and insults, yet the moment someone dares to criticise Farkel, they pounce upon that one. Everything that comes out of the cult "leaders" mouths are accepted and praised to the heavens, yet the contributions of a hundred others are discarded, despite being just as good, if not better.
Just because someone is out of the JW cult, does not mean that they have abandoned the cult mentality. This board is an interesting place to observe and study such human behaviour.
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refiners fire
..."Your repeated reference to Ray as my god was an interesting ploy"....
Hey Teej, I didnt know there was a cult of Ray, where do I join up? Lol.
Actually, I reckon a lot of the "godlike" posters that used to hang around here( not so much these days) are pretty overblown. Intellectually, Feurbacker (or however you spell it) isnt "overblown", intellectually hes a clever dude, no doubt about it. But the guy comes across like a robot. Hes got all the charisma of a wooden indian packed full of computer circuits. Though I must admit, I thought his accusation that you were a member of some sect that 'worships' Ray Franz appeared unfounded.Not very logical. I think maybe he should have posted some evidence to back his claim, but he didnt. very disappointing.
A lot of people rave about a poster called 'focus' but personally Ive never been able to read the guy without needing oxygen. I mean, who wants to read a 6 page diatribe with 130 links in it? sheesh. Talk about full of his own genius. I tried reading him a couple times but found that his spiels made no sense that i could fathom and i concluded that he was trying to bamboozle with scientific looking posts full of highlighted words and cross references. So that was the end of him.
As for the Meister. Well, he appears to have fallen on hard mental times. Over the past x months hes been a shadow of his former self and has been a two trick pony in terms of verbal jousting. Maybe he always was a two trick pony. But the clamouring masses still cry 'hail Farkel' every time the guy belches. Living on past glory I think with that one.
I think theres a very great tendancy for the masses of relatively unread, verbally incoherent posters to quake before the godlike 'genius' posters, and i think it was in this sense that you made reference to 'cults'. The tendancy to adulate and grovel to the "in" posters is no where NEAR so great as it was 18 months ago.
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teejay
RF,
Your (and Prisca's) post were splendid, but this was the icing on the cake:
I think theres a very great tendancy for the masses of relatively unread, verbally incoherent posters to quake before the godlike 'genius' posters, and i think it was in this sense that you made reference to 'cults'. The tendancy to adulate and grovel to the "in" posters is no where NEAR so great as it was 18 months ago.
I couldn't agree more with either observation. Thanks.
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Aztec
I'm with SP. *sigh*
~Az
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Realist
First of all I want to say that I really like AlanF, but I disagree with his synopsis of Teejay's words. What I got from what he said was this. It's fine to read another's words and gain incite from them as he did with Franz' book. His problem though, was that some people adopt this new person's ideas (Farkel & AlanF) and stopping thinking for themselves. These same people feel the need to defend their "cult leaders" at every avenue and believe almost everything they say.
that is a very reasonable assessment of the situation in my opinion. that "followers" even defend unfounded and primitive personal attacked lends quite some credibility to TJ's and SP's standpoint. Robyn,
It seems to me that Farkel is Farkel. He is highly intelligent and a passionate person. Most artists are passionate. He shouldn't have to apologize for being who he is. None of us should have to. We all add our own flavor to this board.
yes farkel is farkel and no he doesn'T have to apologize for what he is. but he has no right to insult other people...nobody has that right regardless of whether ones hobby is cooking, playing an instrument or reading the newspaper. as to the artist....have you seen the seinfeld episode about the Maestro? that sums up his attitude pretty much.